[RFB2]

I thought a few of you would find this interesting.

About eight months ago I noticed one of my male phantasticus was acting a little different. He was sleeping away from the other 1.2 cage mates that he always stuck close to. I started checking them at night every few hours or so. I started witnessing the other male bullying him around. Male fighting male is not strange. What I find interesting is that after these incidents my females started laying fertile eggs. I took the less dominant male out of course and recently tried rotating both of the males.

The odd duck would still stay away from the females. The dominant male acted pretty stressed he was pacing in the upper corner of cage placed across the room. He only ate a little and spent most of the nights pacing back and forth. I kept them like this for over 5 weeks. This resulted in both of my female dropping infertile eggs. I rotated the males once again and the dominant male went for his usual resting spot among the females. It looks like my females are both gravid once again. I suspect one of them will lay eggs within the next week or so.

Could be nothing, but I found it a little interesting none the less.

[jadrig]

Yeah, I added a new male to my 2year LTC 1.1. The new male was a little smaller, but he fit into the clan. I separated the three of them, then put them back together. A couple nights later, I noticed my new male riding the female...When I turned the light on, I was shocked. I got a picture of it. I am not sure if he made a connection or not. But, during this month time period, I noticed my original/bigger male sleeping on the other side of their 20 gal tank.

[RFB2]

I thought it was pretty interesting. The dominant male seemed to know where the females where even from across the room. I also found it strange that this was the only form of aggression I had seen between the males, to only find fertile eggs from that point on. I was curious to see if they form some sort of a bond. I plan on doing a take down and rebuild of their enclosure. I plan on separating everyone for a few days/weeks. I would like to see how they react after I put them together again in a new setup.

[jadrig]

I was thinking of doin something similar with the 2.1 that I have, but I was going to leave the male that tried mating in the cage and separate the other two out. This way, the dominant male can claim his territory first and then the female in it.

[miguel camacho!]

One of the reasons I started keeping multiple pairs together was for the idea that with the added pressure for competition may hypothetically make the males more inclined to mate with the females. As long as you keep the males in check, you can separate the males that get bullied or the dominant males. I saw a good bit of aggression between my males, but also got to the point where all of my adults were breeding.

Having multiple males in an enclosure will no doubt create stress on the "submissive" males, but checking each one often and making sure they're still healthy is key. I only ever had one super-dominant male (none of the other males messed with him, but he always messed with the others). But having large enough of an enclosure so each male can have its own personal space is key. If you catch one male in a multiple-male enclosure obviously courting a female, keep your eyes peeled on the reactions of the other male(s) that aren't first in chase. You'll probably notice more than one male going after a single female. I believe there may be certain cues from the females to signal when they're receptive.

[RFB2]

Thanks for your input Mike.

I have noticed that with my larger female she tends to vibrate the end of her tail when she becomes receptive. She does not do the tail wave like the rest of the phants. Instead the very tip of the tail, the last 1/4 or so, does the movement. I saw here first do this a few months ago. She was on a branch of the schefflera. It was strong enough to make the leaves on her branch shake slightly.

Is this anything you have heard of or seen before? I have seen it only twice and with the same female, but she is the one who is consistently laying fertile eggs.