[sushigex]

So its a little blow to my ego starting a thread like this, but recently I have been struggling with raising up phantasticus neonates. It's like there is a hurdle you must pass and they than become significantly hardier. It's absolutely crushed me but over the last few clutches I have lost 1.2 about a month out of the egg.

The male I presume had a cricket bite it's tail, because it had a little bubble on the base of it's tail that looked like a blister. A day later it dropped it's tail and soon after kicked the bucket. This was a bummer but it's the loss of the two females that I don't really have an answer for. For some reason they just seem even more delicate than the males. I had to help all of them out of their first shed, and I speculate that the stress added by this put them on a bad course. Weird thing was that they were eating and defecating, but on a much less consistent basis than the males.

I rear them in small sterilite bins, about the size of a large pencil box, in a rack with a few holes for ventilation. Ive been using paper towel with some thin wood branches and fake plastic plants. I'm pretty diligent about not letting these bins get too damp but speculate that there isn't enough fresh airflow in these bins. Temps are 70 to 72 during the day with a slight drop off at night. Im going to change this to small Kritter keepers and go with peat/coco fiber going forward.

As far as the crickets got I'm offering pretty small crickets, Id say about 14 day old that definitely seem to be the right size relative to the geckos head. They are dusted with Repashy ICB and offered about 3 a feeding. The next day I remove them in the morning if not eaten. I'm also looking to maybe switch over to predominantly b.lateralis instead of crickets in the future. I have given dubia nymphs but have seen instances where a dubia will grip onto a gecko inadvertently and stress a gecko out.

Im hoping some others can chime in on this as losing geckos like this is something I'm just not at all used to. In fact I've never lost ANY other geckos that I keep period. I do recognize the fact that raising neonate uroplatus in general has a degree of difficulty but I just can't deal with losing geckos, especially ones that are so labor intensive to raise compared to the majority of other species.

[jadrig]

B.lateralis are great for baby/subadult Uroplatus...but they are pretty aggressive. I have a baby P.klemmeri that was having a hard time right out the gate. Klemmeri have to be at least a month old before they can down a D.hydei, but I had some freshly hatched lateralis. The baby gecko did not eat the roach...and I believe that the roach bit into the geckos tail because it dropped the last 1/3 of the tail. A couple days later, I noticed another segment of the tail dropped. After that, I found the baby roach in the container and removed it. I would suggest using a little feeding dish. I have all of my baby gecko containers enclosed (lobster roach proof), but sometimes use feed bowls. I keep every baby separate...No matter what the circumstances...one gecko is always 'not as strong' as the other.
I have never had any baby satanics but I would imagine that D.hydei would suffice for the first month or two.
Also, if you are helping them with their first shed...it is most likely not due to your neonate husbandry, but more so incubation problems. When they are hatching...It must not be humid/moist enough if they are having troubles shedding.

[sushigex]

Yeah I keep them all separate, so that's not an issue. I should try fruit flies again, last few times it seemed like they were climbing out of the bins. I see what your saying about the humidity and shedding. I keep a pretty decent variety of geckos and it's only the phants that I worry about shedding.

[miguel camacho!]

You should try to buy a fine mesh to cover the enclosure to prevent fly escapes. Also, if you place the flies in the fridge for a short period of time before introducing them to the geckos, it stuns them and makes them easier to dust/place in the cage.

[D.B.Johnson]

My 2 cents...

I have found with the little phants that a little bigger, more complex cage seems to stimulate them to hunt and eat better than they do in a smaller, simpler one. I've had hatchlings that would seem to be totally unaware of a cricket passing right in front if them in a small container. When I put them in a little larger, taller, better furnished cage they would seem to notice a cricket from across the container and move after it. Obviously I'm not saying to put a hatchling in a 10 gallon or something crazy. I'm imagining your containers being around the length of a pencil, and I would say to try something with the height being the longest dimension--maybe about 2 pencil lengths tall or something.

Having said that, I have certainly lost hatchlings myself. Some hatchlings are simply going to be weaker than others, based on things like incubation time/temperatures and the condition of the female laying the eggs. Some eggs are smaller than others. I've had hatchlings that shed themselves, and a good many that didn't. It doesn't seem to me like low humidity causes the poor sheds. They just don't seem to put any energy into taking it off. When you remove the skin, it comes off easily enough. Usually the ones that shed on their own prove to be hardier.

Good luck...I don't think anyone can claim to raise phantasticus without the loss of some hatchlings though.

[Calfirecap]

Charles,
First off you are doing the right thing by switching over to the Kritter keepers with a natural substrate. Paper dries out too fast and one of the advantages of the Kritter keepers is the ventillation provided by the snap top.

As for food, if you are using the new Black crickets, that could be your problem, as among other things, they bite back and could certainly be responsible to the tail loss you mentioned. The 1/8" grey/brown crickets are just fine for neonate phants.

As B.D. Johnson mentioned there are differences in the strength and vitality of some neonates based upon various factors. Low hatch weight is one factor I have found to be of importance. It's really very simple, the larger the hatchling the greater the chance of survival. A 0.3 gram hatchling has a much more difficult time than a 0.6 gram hatchling. Now I'm not saying a 0.3 gramer won't survive, as I've had some of them do so, they are just more difficult to raise up. I believe they are more susceptable to dehydration.

I've gone to a lower incubation temperature which results in a longer incubation duration and my hatchling survival rate and hatch weights have gone up. I don't have any proof that lower incubation temps are better, but that is my opinion. There are just too many variables to be ceretain. I do know others who use higher temps with shorter incubation durations who have done just fine. (I use a winter day time temp of 69.3 with a night time temp drop of 2 degrees. In the summer I bring it up a half a degree or so)

Good luck with the neonates and I hope this helps.

Lawrence

[sushigex]

Just an update as I appreciated all the good advice on initial query. Since moving the last few hatchlings into the Kritter keepers I feel they do much better. I have a substrate of coco fiber and some Ficus clippings for perches and cover. I have what looks to be one more good egg and I'm out of phants. I'm really gonna miss them and would love to see just one more satanic hatchling, it's always puts a smile on your face.