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Thread: Supplements

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elizabeth Freer View Post
    Have you read post #22? What am I to think?

    Hilde writes this final paragraph:

    "Some people shy away from supplementing with pre-formed Vitamin A. It's been proven that geckos need it, they can't convert beta-carotene well enough to make do with just that. If the parents of your gecko were only supplemented with beta-carotene, no pre-formed Vit A, then they were prime candidates for a Vit A deficiency, and their offspring suffered the consequences. At the very least, add some pre-formed Vit A to the supplements a few times a month. Most can be beta-carotene, but the bit of pre-formed A will tide them over until they get enough beta-carotene converted."

    PS: Zoo Med's Reptivite is manufactured with and without vitamin D3. I've always recommended no D3 Reptivite.
    Since at my own request my deletion didnt happen and this nonsense still shows in my mailbox (4am-12am) in the path of Raab gives little time.

    (1%) if you care that much or put that much brain power into a vitamin you need a support group or professional help, theoretically of course but thanks Elizabeth.

    Oh, my ambient temps jumped into the low 90's during the day maybe 73 at night. Removed heat mat for seventy two hours....Undigested Dubias look like Caramel Corn.
    Last edited by LEOPARD1; 06-01-2015 at 09:49 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thorrshamri View Post
    More about vitamins -all vertebrates need vitamin C. Did you (Liz and captain) that vitamin A oxydates through the oxygen present in the air within 30 minutes? Once combined with oxygen, it is just useless. Check on sites about fresh, homemade orange juices for example. The same applies to Vitamin C tablets exposed to ambient air. Still, 99,9% of humans and geckos alike don't suffer from scorbut, the disease induced by a vitamin A deficiency, unless you are a 18th Century sailor unable to store fresh fruit and fresh meat
    So from what you're saying should I bother with the reptivite? What's your vitamin schedule like for leopard geckos??

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    Use Vionate and a Calcium Supplement w/o/d3 Do the math, place in dish and let Gecko "Self-Supplement'. My dish had so little supplement and last 6 months.

    Jazakallah Khair

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    I've read that you shouldn't place vitamins or calcium dishes just in a tank, even her breeder told me that's not a good idea as they'll eat too much and cause issues for themselves. I'm interested on hearing thorrshamri's supplement regimen.
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    @thorrshamri is s very respected individual I'm sure all his herps are in great condition. I also wish I had his tact but people like me are black and white for the most part then send others to Jahaanam.

    I just brought up a method used for decades. It started I assume when I was 8. Just a few very small scale unsuccessful breeders use it. The hobbyists well...you see the Vitamin A and Vitamin D3 "Death from Vitamin" posts plastered across all the Leo Forums on a daily basis, oh Leopard Geckos do with supplements the same thing I do with this Forum; we both take what we need and leave the rest (Leopard Geckos self regulate).

    Bottom line: Research for the products used is generally funded by.........you guessed it! The objective resesrch is just that OBJECTIVE.

    Whether dusting or self regulating ALOT of us including myself are throwing sh*t at the wall and seeing what sticks..

    My $10 for free........
    Last edited by LEOPARD1; 06-01-2015 at 10:38 PM.
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    Thorrshamri discusses his supplement schedule and gutloading routine in this thread if you want to check it out: Hello from INDIANA
    There's a lot of info, but I found it helpful. He said that he dusts with Miner-All Indoor at every feeding.
    Last edited by JIMI; 06-01-2015 at 11:21 PM. Reason: Typo
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    Quote Originally Posted by JIMI View Post
    Thorhamri discusses his supplement schedule and gutloading routine in this thread if you want to check it out: Hello from INDIANA
    There's a lot of info, but I found it helpful. He said that he dusts with Miner-All Indoor at every feeding.
    Alhamdulillah.

    I wondered why so many Leos thrived on Miner-All. It being such a terrible product per our resident expert.

    Unfortunately if you let the Gecko self supplement ( especially with Miner-All Indoor (berry flavor) for a few months the animals you are putting no effort into selling get sold. I miss you girl! "Pour that 40oz of OE on the floor" she was a good girl. Im glad the owner paid the "Precautionary Vet Bill" because I can afford some Crap Floats and Stains but it is a B**Ch getting blood from an LG. In 2000 I could hit a vein in the dark, oh well what should I expect from a Vet Tech?

    She was not happy being woken up at 1pm from her nap.......
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by LEOPARD1; 06-02-2015 at 03:25 AM.
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    Thanks for the link! Provided some much needed info. Going to follow thorrshamri's advice with the proper feeding and gutloading of crickets. I really need a narrower list of proper veggies and fruits that can be fed. I work at a grocery store and have to feed myself so I only have so much. I can put money aside for fruits and such but I can't be buying one of everything so are there like 5-10 things I should definitely get? I know carrots, dandelion greens, apples, oranges, parsley, and mango are a few things. Could you help me out @thorrshamri with putting together a good list? I need variety as you stated but I can't be buying out the produce section XD I am wayyy too poor for that.
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    Quote Originally Posted by xxohmycaptainxx View Post
    Thanks for the link! Provided some much needed info. Going to follow thorrshamri's advice with the proper feeding and gutloading of crickets. I really need a narrower list of proper veggies and fruits that can be fed. I work at a grocery store and have to feed myself so I only have so much. I can put money aside for fruits and such but I can't be buying one of everything so are there like 5-10 things I should definitely get? I know carrots, dandelion greens, apples, oranges, parsley, and mango are a few things. Could you help me out @thorrshamri with putting together a good list? I need variety as you stated but I can't be buying out the produce section XD I am wayyy too poor for that.
    "There is no such thing as poor. Just accepting your screwed"
    Last edited by LEOPARD1; 06-02-2015 at 03:26 AM.

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    As my point of view is required...here I am.

    I leave a small plastic cork during breeding periods for all my gecko species, that enables females to get extra calcium and D3. They won't use it if they don't need to, females have a natural instinct to seek calcium and D3 sources when they need it, they just ignore it when it's not necessary. So in any case, that will not harm.

    As for routine supplementation, as I said, I've been using Miner-All Indoors for years. On every feeding, in spite of the recommendations from the manufacturer. Why?

    1. Miner-All I has interesting physical properties, it really sticks well to prey compared to other brands with which the dusting goes away within minutes; still, if insects are eaten several hours after having been dusted, they will have lost most of this dusting. Using the supplement on every feeding thus brings a balance for this loss.

    2. Can we precisely control the exact amount dusted on a prey insect?

    Of course we can't. For example, it can depend on which species of feeder insect you are using, as well as their growth stage and size. Dubia roaches have deep ditch-like "stripes" on their backs and they retain more dusting than for example locusts or crickets. It depends too on how much powder weight is dusted on how many insects.

    I have asked Linda from Sticky Tongue Farms which produce Miner-All Indoors Their recommendations don't take such factors into account and are based on Maths. In other words, using it on every other feeding as the recommend don't take into account the dusting loss, insect type, and so on. So, on a theorical level, it is absolutely safe to use it on every feeding.

    As for other supplements, just don't use them if they contain phosphorous. It is a matter of the Ca/P ratio which should be 2 or more, and insects already contain way too much phosphorous. Reptivite contains phosphorous as far as I know, so even without D3, I wouldn't recommend it.

    Again, beyond theories, if I were to have any issues with my animals by doing what I do for years with supplementation, I would have been aware of it for a long time!

    Last but not least, we may have different opinions, but we are here to help others. So, to all of you, please keep this in mind:

    -no argument needed, no firing up, please. Things can be said with enough mutual respect between members.

    -helping is the main focus, don't go off topic please.

    -I -and probably most of the forum members- have poor, if none, understanding of arabic. I may reply sometimes in French as I am French myself to other French-speaking members, but always with a translation into English, for everyone's understanding. GU is based in the US so using English should be the norm, apart from members who know each other well and start discussions f.e. in German. I suppose the words used by LEOPARD1 are from the Quran. I have no problems with this, just make sure all what you say is understandable for us all. That said, the care sheet section is an exception since it is allowed to post care sheets in other languages, but that does NOT apply to other sections of the forum.

    -Just be careful if you use expressions related to any belief or religion. That could trigger some bad reactions from other people, and we focus on geckos, not on personal beliefs. I have no personal issue with people referring to God, Allah, Jeovah, Buddha...Yet on a forum dedicated to geckos, it might not be necessary. Or else I could need to use Thor's Hammer to send some thunderbolts to the evil Frost Giants around and drink mead from their skulls

    Keep your cool, and everyone should put back guns in the drawers and fangs inside their mouths :P that's the best way to encourage others to read posts and find some help!
    "Thorr Geckos" private breeder in Normandy.

    Specialized in Ptenopus, Pachydactylus, Chondrodactylus, Hemidactylus, Ptyodactylus, Uroplatus genera, AFTs, picta, Gehyra marginata, South Americans, Ptychs...

    FORUM RULES HERE! PLEASE READ THEM CAREFULLY, ESPECIALLY NEWCOMERS TO GU! http://www.geckosunlimited.com/commu...les-rules.html
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