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    Default Phosphorus Questions


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    I have tried reading online and can't really seem to find a good answer, so I figured I'd ask the collective minds here

    I know that all feeders need to be on a low phosphorus food, as well as some fresh veggies like dark greens and such. However, I currently have thousands of mealworms and they would blow through pro gutload if they were all on it 24/7.

    Right now I am keeping the beetles on an oat and wheat bran blend since it's too large to fall through the screen bottoms of their boxes.
    The eggs and micro-worms are on a pro gutload / bran mix until they are big enough to be sifted out with a mesh sieve. They seem to have difficulty breaking down oats when they are newly hatched.
    I have been keeping the majority on bran and oats since it is very cheap, then moving the ones that are being fed into a separate container with just pro gutload until they are fed off. They are usually on this at a minimum of 3 days before being fed to the geckos.

    I'm just wondering if anyone knows how long mealworms would clear the high phosphorus grain from their systems? Should I keep my reptile feeders on this longer - I can set up a separate set of bins if needed. Also, does anyone else seem to have issues with the pro gutload molding? Mine seems to get funky around the veggies, if they are removed / replaced daily it will start to mold.

    ------------------------------------------------------------------------

    To be clear too, 99% of the mealworms are fed off to chickens and wild birds, so I'm not trying to mass produce them for reptiles other than what some of my friends need.

    The male only gets mealworms maybe once a week at most. My female usually refuses to eat roaches so she gets them more often. They are always also supplemented as the usual 18+ month schedule with uvb use.
    Nature is the best teacher, learn by observing

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    Also, does anyone else seem to have issues with the pro gutload molding? Mine seems to get funky around the veggies, if they are removed / replaced daily it will start to mold.
    Can you place the veggies in a shallow plastic container to separate them from Pro Gutoad, yet still be accessible to the feeders?
    Click: Leopard Gecko Care Sheet's Table of Contents

    Oedura castelnaui ~ Lepidodactylus lugubris ~ Gekko kuhli ~ Cyrtodactylus zebraicus ~ Phyllurus platurus ~ Eublepharis macularius ~ Correlophus ciliatus ~ (Phelsuma barbouri) ~ (Lygodactylus kimhowelli) ~ (P tigrinus) ~ (P klemmeri) ~ (H garnotii)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elizabeth Freer View Post
    Can you place the veggies in a shallow plastic container to separate them from Pro Gutoad, yet still be accessible to the feeders?
    For the larger ones I can, the tiny ones seem to have trouble climbing / sensing the vegges. Leafy greens don't mold as bad, but they also dry out really fast too. I've even tried laying the veggies on cut up toilet paper rolls and changing out the cardboard, which helps some, but doesn't solve the issue.

    Dubia.com sells these insect feeding bowls that are made of mesh, which when turned upside down make a kind of 'table', but only bigger worms can climb them.
    Nature is the best teacher, learn by observing
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpottedDragon View Post
    For the larger ones I can, the tiny ones seem to have trouble climbing / sensing the vegges. Leafy greens don't mold as bad, but they also dry out really fast too. I've even tried laying the veggies on cut up toilet paper rolls and changing out the cardboard, which helps some, but doesn't solve the issue.

    Dubia.com sells these insect feeding bowls that are made of mesh, which when turned upside down make a kind of 'table', but only bigger worms can climb them.
    Please link dubia.com's insect feeding bowls.

    Could fine wire mesh from a hardware store (like window screen mesh) be fashioned into a ramp to help smaller feeders access their veggies? Would weed blocker cloth ramps work IF placed on top of Dubia.com's insect feeding bowls?

    Last edited by Elizabeth Freer; 07-21-2022 at 02:38 AM.
    Click: Leopard Gecko Care Sheet's Table of Contents

    Oedura castelnaui ~ Lepidodactylus lugubris ~ Gekko kuhli ~ Cyrtodactylus zebraicus ~ Phyllurus platurus ~ Eublepharis macularius ~ Correlophus ciliatus ~ (Phelsuma barbouri) ~ (Lygodactylus kimhowelli) ~ (P tigrinus) ~ (P klemmeri) ~ (H garnotii)
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpottedDragon View Post
    I have tried reading online and can't really seem to find a good answer, so I figured I'd ask the collective minds here

    I know that all feeders need to be on a low phosphorus food, as well as some fresh veggies like dark greens and such. However, I currently have thousands of mealworms and they would blow through pro gutload if they were all on it 24/7.

    Right now I am keeping the beetles on an oat and wheat bran blend since it's too large to fall through the screen bottoms of their boxes.
    The eggs and micro-worms are on a pro gutload / bran mix until they are big enough to be sifted out with a mesh sieve. They seem to have difficulty breaking down oats when they are newly hatched.
    I have been keeping the majority on bran and oats since it is very cheap, then moving the ones that are being fed into a separate container with just pro gutload until they are fed off. They are usually on this at a minimum of 3 days before being fed to the geckos.

    I'm just wondering if anyone knows ? Should I keep my reptile feeders on this longer - I can set up a separate set of bins if needed. Also, does anyone else seem to have issues with the pro gutload molding? Mine seems to get funky around the veggies, if they are removed / replaced daily it will start to mold.

    ------------------------------------------------------------------------

    To be clear too, 99% of the mealworms are fed off to chickens and wild birds, so I'm not trying to mass produce them for reptiles other than what some of my friends need.

    The male only gets mealworms maybe once a week at most. My female usually refuses to eat roaches so she gets them more often. They are always also supplemented as the usual 18+ month schedule with uvb use.
    Also, does anyone else seem to have issues with the pro gutload molding?

    I would just scoop out that portion and throw out the veggies daily. (Wasteful)


    how long mealworms would clear the high phosphorus grain from their systems?

    If you mean to balance out the calcium to phosphorus ratio?

    The amount of calcium would need to be higher in the feed. Pro gut load is a maintenance diet, not high calcium.
    Last edited by Blush50; 07-22-2022 at 11:26 PM.

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    I’m a visual person and need to see this If it’s created

    fine wire mesh from a hardware store (like window screen mesh)
    Last edited by Blush50; 07-22-2022 at 11:23 PM.

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    Thanks to admin Hilde . . . . . .

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    Click: Leopard Gecko Care Sheet's Table of Contents

    Oedura castelnaui ~ Lepidodactylus lugubris ~ Gekko kuhli ~ Cyrtodactylus zebraicus ~ Phyllurus platurus ~ Eublepharis macularius ~ Correlophus ciliatus ~ (Phelsuma barbouri) ~ (Lygodactylus kimhowelli) ~ (P tigrinus) ~ (P klemmeri) ~ (H garnotii)

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    Sorry, I didn't see that anyone responded, but yes - like window screen mesh. Here's a picture of my first trial bin, it's empty - this method should work with any size tubs

    1. you can see that these are stacked so that they are 'nested'. the one with the mesh screen is on top, where the beetles would be
    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...0/IMG_3586.JPG

    2. a top down view
    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...6/IMG_3587.JPG

    3. Both.
    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...6/IMG_3588.JPG

    The beetles lay eggs in the oats and just them moving around constantly is enough to drop most of the eggs through the screen and into the lower bin. I would then replace the lower bin with fresh bedding about once a month to every 45 days. It takes about 3 months for the mealworms to grow to "large" size. So I end up with a bunch of bins segregated by age and size. The beetles and feeders stay in the reptile room, the rest are in the basement. I'd have pictures of all that, but I just sold off about 2/3 of the worms for fair season (chicken people love them) and have the bins disinfecting out side. In the winter their growth really slows too.

    The only thing I'd say is that in the first trial bin I had trouble with some sort of other bug getting into it - there would be 1000s of tiny grey mite-looking things on the carrots / veggies. I still have no idea what kind of bug they were and would freeze the whole lot of it to kill them since I wasn't sure if they'd be harmful to the reptiles turn into some sort of infestation. I don't have the same problem in my deeper bins.
    Nature is the best teacher, learn by observing
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