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    Default My new family pet!


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    20170919_173844.jpg
    This is my LG Fii. She was a donation at a pet store I work at that I got to take home! The only information I know is that she is 2 years old, has not been handled much, and only had one owner. He gave little to no information, so I'm not even sure of her diet.

    Speaking of diet I decided through research to put her on a mealworm/silkworm diet with the occasional waxworms. What's the typical weight of a female LG?

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    Default New home, possible worries! Not eating/pooping

    Ok, maybe I'm overreacting, maybe I'm not. I just got my LG two-three days ago, so I'm sure she is stressed out, but don't they normally eat within a day? The only reason why I ask this is because I work at a mom and pop pet store and any LGs we got in (usually donation) ate within a few hours of being put into a new environment. But this one I got hasn't eaten or pooped at all. All she does is hide.

    At first she was active at night the first day I had her. The very first morning (second day) with her I found her sort of soaking in the bowl. After which she hasn't left her hide. I've even tried hand feeding and she didn't even notice the waxworm. I also don't know her diet or the last time she ate/defecated.

    Temperature wise we set our apartment to 75F. During the day it's hotter, and during night we make sure the heater is on. Now, right now I've got her in the travel cage (she is pictured with) with NO substrate at the moment, and I've made sure to include a bowl of water, a bowl with some waxworms (stores in my town are out of mealworms and I know crickets are harbors of diseases since I deal with them on a daily basis at work) and of course she has a bamboo hide/tunnel. I also have a Zoo Med Reptitherm UTH mini, which is the only heating pads safe enough for the plastic travel cages. I put it on the side next to her hide last night.

    Now, mind you, I just got the day off work today, so I'm buying a proper cage for her. This will probably stress her out more. Should I leave her in the temporary one for a few more days, or should I move her when I've got her terrarium set up?

    Edit: Her set up ATM. Sorry for the crappy picture. The heating pad is hard to see since the cage is in front of my TV but it's on the left.
    20170921_074606.jpg
    Last edited by Sybilestial; 09-21-2017 at 10:51 AM. Reason: Added a picture
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    I merged both your threads so that all the info is in one place, including the pictures.
    It helps to make it easier for giving advice.

    Seems to me, that she's stressed from being moved, and not having a proper set-up. She should improve once she gets a proper set-up, heat, and a chance to settle in.
    Thanks Sybilestial thanked for this post
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    20170921_134912.jpg20170921_134842.jpg
    She is doing much better. I've got fresh water, mealworms and waxworms, and I'm using Exo-Terra Moss mat (artificial). She loved exploring! I've got two stick thermometers as well. Her bamboo "hide" is the warm hide. It's a start! I will get to the others as I can afford it.

    Good news; I counted the waxworms - and unless they ate each other - I think she ate two. I had put 5 in and there were none in her temporary cage besides the bowl I put them in.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sybilestial View Post
    20170921_134912.jpg20170921_134842.jpg
    She is doing much better. I've got fresh water, mealworms and waxworms, and I'm using Exo-Terra Moss mat (artificial). She loved exploring! I've got two stick thermometers as well. Her bamboo "hide" is the warm hide. It's a start! I will get to the others as I can afford it.

    Good news; I counted the waxworms - and unless they ate each other - I think she ate two. I had put 5 in and there were none in her temporary cage besides the bowl I put them in.
    Welcome aboard! What a beautiful leo! She'll thrive much better in a 20 gallon long (minimum): 30 x 12 x 12 inches ASAP. One big box store offers $-per-gallon sales all the time.

    Please post a picture of your thermometers.

    There are many improvements that should be made right away.
    • Can you buy a 20 gallon long for her now?
    • What is her warm end temperature?
    • Place a larger heat mat underneath the vivarium. Heat rises, so side mounted heat pads are not efficient. For a 10 gallon I recommend either the Zoo Med 6 x 8 inch or the 8 x 12 inch. Go by dimensions, not by printed suggestions.
    • How are you doing for powdered supplements?


    You can make 2 other hides like this: warm moist and cool dry.
    Last edited by Elizabeth Freer; 09-23-2017 at 04:17 AM.
    "If you can hear crickets, it's still summer." ;)

    "May the peace that
    You find at the beach
    Follow you home"

    Click: Leo Care Sheet's Table of Contents

    ===> No plain calcium, calcium with D3, or multivitamins inside an enclosure <===

    Oedura castelnaui ~ Lepidodactylus lugubris ~ Phelsuma barbouri ~ Ptychozoon kuhli ~ Cyrtodactylus peguensis zebraicus ~ Phyllurus platurus ~ Eublepharis macularius ~ Correlophus ciliatus ~ (L kimhowelli) ~ (P tigrinus) ~ (P klemmeri) ~ (H garnotii)

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    Leopard Gecko Care

    To view click Leopard Gecko Setup, not the arrow:
    Updates to video



    1. ===> No plain calcium, calcium with D3, or multivitamins inside a vivarium <===

    2. Best to buy stuff individually rather than getting a 10 gallon set up kit.

    3. Avoid cedar, pine, willow, or fir bark in reptile enclosures. Cedar fumes and oils are highly toxic to reptiles; pine fumes and oils are toxic as well!

    4. Quarantine Recommendations
    • Any new gecko should be quarantined for a minimum of 90 days prior to introducing her/him to the other geckos in the same cage. That gives adequate time to check for parasites, cryptosporidia, and the beginnings of coccidia plus. 3-6 months of quarantine are recommended if your new gecko is imported or wild caught.
    • The quarantine area should be in a separate room apart from your established geckos. Stringent sanitation methods MUST be followed!

    5. Occupant(s) - Best to house leos alone. Leos do not benefit from companions or “friends”.
    • Never keep 2 males together. They will seriously fight!
    • Even 2 similarly sized females can fight.

    6. Enclosure - Consider a 20 gallon LONG vivarium (30 inches long x 12 inches deep x 12 inch tall) a minimum "forever" home" for one 70 gram leo. That's 76 cm x 31 cm x 31 cm. Get the largest enclosure you can afford.

    7. Heating - Your Under Tank Heat mat (UTH) should be 1/2 the length of the enclosure's ground and reach from side to side of the enclosure. One of two dry hides and the moist hide should sit right on top of the UTH.

    Your leopard gecko will be more active if you provide an UTH for belly heat/digestion as well as an overhead dome with a Ceramic Heat Emitter to warm the air. Then your leo benefits from a "warm zone", not only a "warm spot". The UTH and the CHE both belong on the warm end of the tank. The UTH and the CHE each require separate thermostats since the settings will be different.

    • If you have a 10 gallon enclosure, use Zoo Med's 8 x 12 inch UTH (or maybe the 6 x 8 inch) UTH.
    • If you have a 20 gallon LONG: 30 x 12 x 12 inches, use an 11 x 17 inch UTH. The 11 x 17 inch will not compromise cool end temperatures. Another GU member does this and still gets 76*F for her cool end. Both Fluker's and Ultratherm make this size.
    • Use heat cables to customize heating when standard size UTHs don't cover the total width and half the length.

    8. Substrate - Good choices: rough textured ceramic, porcelain, or slate tiles. Paper towels also work. Add paper towel layers to poop spot to facilitate clean up.
    • I do NOT recommend these particulate substrates: calci-sand, ground walnut shell, sand, Eco Earth's coco fiber, bark chips, aquarium gravel, peat moss, et cetera. The risk of impaction is simply not worth it. After you have had successful experience caring for leos, there are other options. In that case ALL husbandry needs to be spot on!!!
    • If you use tile, you will discover the backsides of tiles have ridges. In order to avoid "hot spots" on the tile's surface, place a thin layer of well-washed play sand underneath the tiles.

    9. Temperatures - A temperature gradient from warm to cool maintains your leo's health. Here's a temperature guide for all leopard geckos as measured with the probe of a digital thermometer (and controlled by a thermostat set at 91*F/32.8*C):
    • 88-92 F (31.1-33.3 C) ground temperature right underneath a leo's warm dry hide
    • no greater than 82ish F (27.8ish C) air temperature - 4 inches above ground on the warm end
    • no greater than 75 F (23.9 C) air temperature - 4 inches above ground on the cool end

    Leave the UTH on 24/7. At night turn off overhead lighting/heating (~12 hours on and ~12 hours off) unless ambient room temperatures drop lower than 67ish*F (19.4*C).

    10. Use a digital thermometer's probe to measure air temps and ground temperatures. Temperature guns are excellent for measuring surface temperatures. A stainless steel aquarium-type thermometer that has been verified can also be used.

    11. Lighting (photoperiod lighting) - To better meet the crepuscular needs of leopard geckos
    • Place a low wattage bulb (15 watt standard incandescent bulb) dimmed to half power inside a 5.5 inch diameter fixture in the center of the screen top and right next to the CHE bulb.
    • Vary the on-time monthly of both the CHE and the photoperiod bulb according to this Pakistan link. For example, 11 hours ON in February is good.
    • Click: Sunrise Sunset Daylight Hours of Pakistan -- Timebie

    12. UVB lighting is recommended for leopard geckos ONLY IF there is adequate space and opportunities for the leopard gecko to dodge some of the rays like in a 4.5 foot x 2 foot x 2 foot vivarium. A 48 inch long vivarium is a suggested minimum for using UVB for leopard geckos. Never use UVB lighting in addition to a powdered vitamin D3 supplement!

    13. Buy a thermostat! A thermostat will control your under tank heater and/or overhead Ceramic Heat Emitter, provide your leopard gecko with stable and comfortable temperatures, save $ on electricity, and lessen the chance of a house fire from accidental overheating. Tape the probe of a reliable digital thermometer to the thermostat's probe to verify the thermostat's setting.
    • Hydrofarm’s Jump Start MTPRTC thermostat is quite satisfactory. The Jump Start MTPRTC has a digital readout and a small metal probe. It's accurate to 1.0*F.
    • Inkbird’s digital thermostat is also good. It has sockets for two devices kept at the same temperature.
    • Apollo thermostats have good ratings. Amazon cost = $20.

    14. 3 hides are needed per leo: warm DRY, warm MOIST, cool DRY. Keeping one hide warm and moist 24/7 is very important! Both warm hides should sit on top of the UTH. The warmth from your UTH helps generate the required humidity. Leopard geckos use their warm moist hides for hydrating even when not shedding.

    15. Supplements
    Dusting a "wee pinch" of Zoo Med's Reptivite multivitamins without vitamin D3 on the feeders @ ONLY 1 feeding per week is what my vet suggests. Then also dust feeders with Zoo Med's Repti Calcium with vitamin D3 @ 1 other feeding per week.

    For leos 18 months old and older, and for leos 12 months old and older who are in good shape:
    • Monday---lightly dust most all the feeders with Zoo Med's Repti Calcium with D3
    • Thursday---lightly dust most all the feeders with Zoo Med's Reptivite multivitamins without D3

    For leos 0 - 12 mo, please refer to post 124 on my Geckos Unlimited Leo Care Sheet.

    16. Too much vitamin D3 and/or calcium is as bad as too little vitamin D3 and/or calcium. Rep-Cal’s Calcium with D3 contains 17x more D3 than does Zoo Med’s Repti Calcium with D3.

    17. Diet
    • Like humans, geckos are what they eat. A huge factor in the husbandry of any gecko is to feed the feeders (crickets, worms, et cetera) a high quality diet 24/7. A variety of feeders is important! Nutritious feeder bodies transfer like nutrients to your geckos. "Light supplemental dusting" of these feeders equals a "sprinkling of powdered sugar upon a cake".
    • Vary the diet: crickets, roaches, hornworms, grasshoppers, silkworms, mealworm pupae, freshly molted mealworms, black soldier fly larvae (Phoenix, repti, calciworms), and locusts (smallest locusts possible).
    • Feed insects and worms a high quality dry diet like finely ground Zoo Med's Natural Adult Bearded Dragon Food with high calcium/low phosphorus veggies on the side like collard greens.
    • If you decide to use poultry food to feed insects and worms, ONLY use the following brands. Other brands contain diatomaceous earth!
      • Albers' All Purpose Poultry Feed OR
      • Purina Layena Sunfresh Crumbles

    18. There are few benefits to feeding waxworms on a regular basis. Those worms are extremely high in fat. If your leo needs to gain weight, feed more of the healthier feeders. Phoenix worms, hornworms, and/or silkworms provide excellent variety. They provide nutrition as well as moisture.

    19. Urates should be white, not yellow, and approximately 1/3 the size of the feces. A healthy feces is dark brown and about the size and shape of 2 tic tacs.

    20. Consider covering 3 sides of your leopard gecko's enclosure with something like brown paper bags or construction paper to provide privacy.

    21. Helpful links
    Last edited by Elizabeth Freer; 09-22-2017 at 05:03 AM.
    "If you can hear crickets, it's still summer." ;)

    "May the peace that
    You find at the beach
    Follow you home"

    Click: Leo Care Sheet's Table of Contents

    ===> No plain calcium, calcium with D3, or multivitamins inside an enclosure <===

    Oedura castelnaui ~ Lepidodactylus lugubris ~ Phelsuma barbouri ~ Ptychozoon kuhli ~ Cyrtodactylus peguensis zebraicus ~ Phyllurus platurus ~ Eublepharis macularius ~ Correlophus ciliatus ~ (L kimhowelli) ~ (P tigrinus) ~ (P klemmeri) ~ (H garnotii)

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    Right now I only bought the temperature strips, one on each side.
    20170922_071147.jpg

    I could only afford to get her a 5.5 gal at the moment as I haven't found any stores in my area that do $-per-gallon sales, or haven't found much online. It sucked because even though there was a $20 drop on a particular tank (It was at least 24L with front doors, but it was $169. I'd rather get that so it is easier to not only get my leo out, but she sees me. Right now if I talk to her and slowly rest my hand on the bottom of the cage, she still flips out a little like she didn't expect it.) Reasoning is that I needed to prioritize her heat. The weather here suddenly dropped from 80F or higher 24/7 to 59-69 at night and barely 70-80 in the daytime. I'm also making sure it stays 75 in my apartment at all times.

    Her warm end temperature is 80-82. I placed the mat on the bottom of the cage located under her bamboo hide.

    I ordered Sticky Tongue Farms Miner-all INDOOR formula which has D3. I work at a pet store and I know the animals don't care for the repti-cal calcium and this one is breeder recommended. I have also looked up reviews and the animals love it by itself. (Not saying they eat too much of it.) It's actually arriving today.

    I do indeed need more hides for her. I'm working on a cool side one once I find something that'll fit. As for warm moist, I don't have any of the moss. Should I take some of her current "fake moss carpet" and mist it, or do you think it'll mold?

    Questions/Responses to video and your changes:

    I thought that they needed a small bottle cap (at least) of calcium in case they don't get enough from dusting? Why do we not do this? I've seen tons of breeders tell us to put them in. Unless you mean I can put the miner-all (Which is calcium) in but not the rest of the items in his video.

    What about backgrounds that have tunnels?

    I'd rather buy stuff individually than a set up.

    For substrate: I either plan on using "moss mats" (artificial, never moist), reptile grass, or ceramic tile. I know that sand is very bad for them.

    Fii is my first and only gecko, so I don't plan on getting one for at least a month. I will quarantine if I do.

    A question about LIGHT: Should I put the light on (10-12 hour intervals) in the morning or at night? Is it possible to condition her to not be nocturnal, or is that something I shouldn't do? I also ask because I'd like to bond with her more than just if I wake up at 1am or super early morning. She hides from 8am-11pm/12am. I also can't tell if she's eating. The last reason is my 2 year old always cries when Fii hides ("Goes nigh night") and he is in love with her. He talks to her a lot.

    Thank you for all the information! I will update whenever I get something that she needs. I'm sorry it's a slow process, but she has better stuff than before. I get paid weekly, so it might take 2-3 weeks before she has the right size terrarium. (As I only ever get an extra $50-$100/week.) If you know of any online stores that are doing sales for $-per-gallon tanks, please post a link!
    Last edited by Sybilestial; 09-22-2017 at 10:59 AM. Reason: Typo
    Thanks Elizabeth Freer thanked for this post

  8. #8
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    20170922_090603.jpg
    Here's the best I can do at the moment. I had to use toilet paper, but she's hanging out in it just fine. It's also on the warm side of the terrarium.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sybilestial View Post
    20170922_090603.jpg
    Here's the best I can do at the moment. I had to use toilet paper, but she's hanging out in it just fine. It's also on the warm side of the terrarium.
    A 5.5 gallon is not big enough at all. Maybe the Goodwill has something bigger. Thoroughly sterilize it with a 10% bleach solution!!!

    • Get another deli cup. Make a much smaller opening that only the gecko can fit through. It will offer more privacy and also hold the humidity better.
    • Your leo needs the temps on the care sheet I posted above. Without that heat, he will be unable to digest his food. Then he will fail to thrive.
    • Your leo enclosure should be 30 inches long. Otherwise it will be difficult to get the warm end and cool end that leo's need.


    What is her total length?

    Have you had the chance to read the care sheet I posted?


    PS:
    Those LCD temperature strips only read "ballpark" temperatures. Your leo needs more accurate readings.

    Please buy a yellow Zoo Med digital thermometer with a probe. They cost about $10.
    Last edited by Elizabeth Freer; 09-22-2017 at 05:22 PM.
    "If you can hear crickets, it's still summer." ;)

    "May the peace that
    You find at the beach
    Follow you home"

    Click: Leo Care Sheet's Table of Contents

    ===> No plain calcium, calcium with D3, or multivitamins inside an enclosure <===

    Oedura castelnaui ~ Lepidodactylus lugubris ~ Phelsuma barbouri ~ Ptychozoon kuhli ~ Cyrtodactylus peguensis zebraicus ~ Phyllurus platurus ~ Eublepharis macularius ~ Correlophus ciliatus ~ (L kimhowelli) ~ (P tigrinus) ~ (P klemmeri) ~ (H garnotii)

  10. #10
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    I'm going to be able to get her a suitable cage the 29th to the 1st of October since I'll get paid then.

    I tried a small opening but she didn't like it so I had to make it bigger. Might need to try something else.

    Like I said, she was a donation at our store so I know nothing of her habits, diet she was on, etc. The only thing I know is she wasn't handled much for her first 2 years of life. So she's a bit jerky and squirmy sometimes and I need to buy those fabric measuring tapes. I need to purchase a gram scale as well.

    Yes, I've read up on the guides. I just wasn't sure of the cost and she was kind of figuratively dropped on us.

    The temp steps were just a quick fix for the small amount of money I had. I plan on getting regular temps as well as the digital thermometers.
    Last edited by Sybilestial; 09-22-2017 at 09:32 PM.

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