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    Question UTH Question - Which Side? Thanks!


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    Hey All!

    Thanks much for reading. New Gecko owner here. Just introduced the little guy (Leonard) who's a youngling to his tank setup today. Made sure to ask the person at the pet store a ton of questions as well as doing hours of research on my end but the two seemed to be at odds (big surprise).

    So I live in Boston (US) where its pretty cold right now. I was told because its only a 10G tank to have my halogen heating lamp on the warm side and the heating pad on the cool side so he can be warm when he sleeps. This is how I set it up but seems to go contrary to much of what Ive read online. He has a hot side hide and perch to the left and 2 cool side hides, one of which allows him to get off the ground but still maintain shade if the heating pad gets toasty (I have 2 plug in digital thermometers coming tomorrow but just an analog now)

    Is this an acceptable setup? With the lamp on the hot side and the pad on the cool side. Basically meaning at night once I turn off the lamp hes able to stay on that side and keep fairly warm. The in tank air temp is about 67 at night even with the pad. Is this alright? Should I spin the tank around to put the UTH AND Halogen lamp on the same side (despite what the pet store person who owns a LG and bearded dragon advised?)

    See image for setup.

    Thank you VERY much for reading and responding it means a lot!

    20200217_231414.jpg

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    Welcome and congrats on your new gecko. I also live in the Boston area and have many geckos in many cages. You're right that if you have a heating pad on one side and a heat lamp on the other side, there is no temperature gradient (pet stores notoriously don't know what they're talking about with reptile care a lot of the time). In my opinion you don't need the light at all. If the gecko is cold, it will stay in its warm hide which will trap the heated air and be very comfortable. In my opinion, as long as there is a warm hide with an under tank heater (which is going to need a thermostat if you don't have one already), any ambient temperature is fine as long as it is comfortable for humans. Too much heat, especially heat from above can dry the air and overheat or dehydrate the gecko. (If you want to see a whole lot of geckos, my house is a gecko/ceramics stop at Somerville Open Studios in May).

    Aliza
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    Thank you very much Aliza! I'm actually in Arlington so I'd love to stop by in May. If you don't mind me asking a couple of follow up questions (and of course I'd love to hear as many opinions as possible from everyone here).

    It gets pretty cold in my house at times (not well insulated) so is there a circumstance where you think both the halogen and pad (on the same side which I know now) might be a good idea? I also have a red halogen bulb I can install and a timer so that it's on for only a short while if that lessened heat source seems a better combo? Could perhaps turning it on from 10 to 3 mid day be advisable? I just want him to be happy and comfortable.

    Also I read that halogens produce UVB light and Ive read that that's preferable to the calcium and D3 powder Im putting on his food now. Does that sound right to you? I read a lot of places that they don't need UVB but since theyre awake for dawn and dusk they do actually get some sunlight in the wild. Sorry if these are silly questions and thanks again!

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    Not silly questions at all! I think the 10-3 light idea is a good one. Leopard geckos, being nocturnal, don't need lots of D3, but they need some. In the wild, they're actually "crepuscular", meaning that they hang out outside around dawn and dusk. I think the problem with the enclosure is that if your leopard gecko is in the hide during all the daytime hours, it may not be benefitting from the UVB. It's a safer bet to dust feeders every other time with calcium + D3. I googled halogen and UVB and got wildly contradicting responses, so I'm not sure. Be aware that if they do emit UVB and you choose to use them, you will need to change the bulb every 6 months or so to maintain the UVB level.


    Aliza

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    Welcome to Geckos Unlimited!

    (I have 2 plug in digital thermometers coming tomorrow but just an analog now)
    Do you mean 2 digital thermostats?

    May I ask which supplement brand, name, and frequency you're using for Leonard's prey? All supplements are different.

    Wait until you upgrade to a larger enclosure before using UVB. I suggest at least a 20 long (30 x 12 x 12 inches tall) as a UVB minimum. When you get a 20 long, Fran Baines of Facebook's Reptile Lighting group recommends Zoo Med's Reptisun mini-compact 10.0 for that UVB bulb. I suggest placing that 10.0 mini in an 8.5 inch diameter lamp dome right above the warm end. Arcadia and Zoo Med produce the best UVB lighting options. I've not seen any info on UVB output from halogen bulbs. If you discover such info, I'm all ears.

    Are you matching these temps? It's perfectly OK to have overnight temps be in the upper 60s.

    Temperatures - A temperature gradient from warm to cool maintains your leo's health. Here's a temperature guide for all leopard geckos as measured with the probe of a digital thermometer or a temp gun (and controlled by a thermostat set at 91*F/32.8*C).

    Place the thermostat's probe and a digital thermometer's probe together right on top of the substrate underneath the warm dry hide. If you use a UTH + a CHE you'll need 2 separate thermostats, because ground and air temperatures are substantially different.
    • Warm end ground temperature: 88-92 F (31.1-33.3 C) inside a leo's warm dry hide and his moist hide too!
    • Cool end ground temperature: 70ish-75 F (21.1-23.9 C) Usually the cool end ground temperature matches the room temperature where the enclosure sits.
    • no greater than 82ish F (27.8ish C) air temperature - 4 inches (10 cm) above ground on the warm end
    • no greater than 75 F (23.9 C) air temperature - 4 inches (10 cm) above ground on the cool end

    Leave the heat mat/UTH on 24/7. If you wish, during the night turn off overhead lighting/heating (~12 hours on and ~12 hours off) unless ambient room temperatures drop lower than 67ish*F (19.4*C).
    Last edited by Elizabeth Freer; 02-18-2020 at 05:16 AM.
    "If you can hear crickets, it's still summer." ;)

    "May the peace that
    You find at the beach
    Follow you home"

    Click: Leo Care Sheet's Table of Contents

    ===> No plain calcium, calcium with D3, or multivitamins inside an enclosure <===

    Oedura castelnaui ~ Lepidodactylus lugubris ~ Phelsuma barbouri ~ Ptychozoon kuhli ~ Cyrtodactylus peguensis zebraicus ~ Phyllurus platurus ~ Eublepharis macularius ~ Correlophus ciliatus ~ (L kimhowelli) ~ (P tigrinus) ~ (P klemmeri) ~ (H garnotii)
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elizabeth Freer View Post
    Welcome to Geckos Unlimited!



    Do you mean 2 digital thermostats?

    May I ask which supplement brand, name, and frequency you're using for Leonard's prey? All supplements are different.

    Wait until you upgrade to a larger enclosure before using UVB. I suggest at least a 20 long (30 x 12 x 12 inches tall) as a UVB minimum. When you get a 20 long, Fran Baines of Facebook's Reptile Lighting group recommends Zoo Med's Reptisun mini-compact 10.0 for that UVB bulb. I suggest placing that 10.0 mini in an 8.5 inch diameter lamp dome right above the warm end. Arcadia and Zoo Med produce the best UVB lighting options. I've not seen any info on UVB output from halogen bulbs. If you discover such info, I'm all ears.

    Are you matching these temps? It's perfectly OK to have overnight temps be in the upper 60s.
    Thank you very much Elizabeth! So I am using this zoo med supplement pictured below. Also sometimes the air is around 65 in the tank so I want to make it a little warmer during the day so i got a timer attached to a red light as well as a Jump Start UTH Plug In monitor/regulator to at least keep the hot hide at 90. Does that seem adequate? Will there be amy negative side effects of having a small red halogen bulb run for a few hours during the day when no ones home and the air temp is really low? Thanks again!! 20200218_183752.jpg

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    Quote Originally Posted by UmphreysMcGee View Post
    Thank you very much Elizabeth! So I am using this zoo med supplement pictured below. Also sometimes the air is around 65 in the tank so I want to make it a little warmer during the day so i got a timer attached to a red light as well as a Jump Start UTH Plug In monitor/regulator to at least keep the hot hide at 90. Does that seem adequate? Will there be amy negative side effects of having a small red halogen bulb run for a few hours during the day when no ones home and the air temp is really low? Thanks again!! 20200218_183752.jpg
    You are welcome!

    About how old is Leonard? How long is he now? Depending upon his age, there are 1-2 additional Zoo Med supplements Leonard will benefit from.

    I'll be getting back with you shortly.
    "If you can hear crickets, it's still summer." ;)

    "May the peace that
    You find at the beach
    Follow you home"

    Click: Leo Care Sheet's Table of Contents

    ===> No plain calcium, calcium with D3, or multivitamins inside an enclosure <===

    Oedura castelnaui ~ Lepidodactylus lugubris ~ Phelsuma barbouri ~ Ptychozoon kuhli ~ Cyrtodactylus peguensis zebraicus ~ Phyllurus platurus ~ Eublepharis macularius ~ Correlophus ciliatus ~ (L kimhowelli) ~ (P tigrinus) ~ (P klemmeri) ~ (H garnotii)
    Thanks UmphreysMcGee thanked for this post
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    Quote Originally Posted by UmphreysMcGee View Post
    Thank you very much Elizabeth! So I am using this zoo med supplement pictured below. Also sometimes the air is around 65 in the tank so I want to make it a little warmer during the day so i got a timer attached to a red light as well as a Jump Start UTH Plug In monitor/regulator to at least keep the hot hide at 90. Does that seem adequate? Will there be amy negative side effects of having a small red halogen bulb run for a few hours during the day when no ones home and the air temp is really low? Thanks again!! 20200218_183752.jpg
    Quote Originally Posted by Elizabeth Freer View Post
    You are welcome!

    About how old is Leonard? How long is he now? Depending upon his age, there are 1-2 additional Zoo Med supplements Leonard will benefit from.

    I'll be getting back with you shortly.
    As long as Leonard can retreat to a warm hide that's ~90*F ground temperature and a cooler hide too, he should be fine.

    I'm uncomfortable using 2 heat sources within a 10 gallon enclosure. I understand Leonard's room is cool, even during the days.

    How about upgrading Leonard's enclosure to a 20 long right now? Then, should there be unforeseen heat issues, he will have more "wiggle room". Add an 11 x 17 inch Ultratherm heat mat to that 20 long! That will not be overkill. Place your red bulb above the heat mat. Turn it on from 10-3 PM. That way Leonard will have a "cool end". Reptile Basics (336-308-5767) seems to offer the best prices on Ultratherms.

    I recommend a 2nd thermostat to control the red bulb. Dimmers/rheostats won't turn off a heat source when it gets too warm.

    A long term Geckos Unlimited member keeps her home set @ 68*F (days) and 64*F (nights). She's kept/keeps leos; she's also bred them. She's never mentioned troubles with that.

    Right now it's 68*F room temp @ 9 AM in the corner where my leo's enclosure sits. The thermostat turns on during the days. It's set for 91*F. Cha just ate 6 crickets. I don't think she'll have problems digesting her meal.

    Zoo Med's Repti Calcium with D3 is excellent! If Leonard is less than 12 months old, here's what I recommend.
    Weekly Schedule 124 for Leopard Geckos 0-12 months old
    (withOUT UVB)
    Early stage metabolic bone disease (MBD) problems include uneven (lopsided) gait, bowed limbs, belly dragging, and an underbite.
    The Reptile Supply Company based in Sacramento, California stocks Zoo Med's ReptiVite multivitamins withOUT D3.
    • Crickets or dubia >> Monday - lightly dusted with Zoo Med's Repti Calcium with D3
    • Mealworms >> Tuesday
    • Crickets or dubia >> Wednesday - lightly dusted with pure precipitated calcium carbonate withOUT D3 (Zoo Med's Repti Calcium or NOW human brand calcium)
    • Crickets or dubia >> Thursday
    • Crickets or dubia >> Friday - lightly dusted with Zoo Med's ReptiVite multivitamins withOUT D3
    • Mealworms or Black Soldier Fly Larvae (Phoenix worms) >> Saturday
    • No food or free choice >> Sunday
    Last edited by Elizabeth Freer; 02-20-2020 at 12:58 PM.
    "If you can hear crickets, it's still summer." ;)

    "May the peace that
    You find at the beach
    Follow you home"

    Click: Leo Care Sheet's Table of Contents

    ===> No plain calcium, calcium with D3, or multivitamins inside an enclosure <===

    Oedura castelnaui ~ Lepidodactylus lugubris ~ Phelsuma barbouri ~ Ptychozoon kuhli ~ Cyrtodactylus peguensis zebraicus ~ Phyllurus platurus ~ Eublepharis macularius ~ Correlophus ciliatus ~ (L kimhowelli) ~ (P tigrinus) ~ (P klemmeri) ~ (H garnotii)
    Thanks UmphreysMcGee thanked for this post
    Likes UmphreysMcGee liked this post

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elizabeth Freer View Post
    As long as Leonard can retreat to a warm hide that's ~90*F ground temperature and a cooler hide too, he should be fine.

    I'm uncomfortable using 2 heat sources within a 10 gallon enclosure. I understand Leonard's room is cool, even during the days.

    How about upgrading Leonard's enclosure to a 20 long right now? Then, should there be unforeseen heat issues, he will have more "wiggle room". Add an 11 x 17 inch Ultratherm heat mat to that 20 long! That will not be overkill. Place your red bulb above the heat mat. Turn it on from 10-3 PM. That way Leonard will have a "cool end". Reptile Basics (336-308-5767) seems to offer the best prices on Ultratherms.

    I recommend a 2nd thermostat to control the red bulb. Dimmers/rheostats won't turn off a heat source when it gets too warm.

    A long term Geckos Unlimited member keeps her home set @ 68*F (days) and 64*F (nights). She's kept/keeps leos; she's also bred them. She's never mentioned troubles with that.

    Right now it's 68*F room temp @ 9 AM in the corner where my leo's enclosure sits. The thermostat turns on during the days. It's set for 91*F. Cha just ate 6 crickets. I don't think she'll have problems digesting her meal.

    Zoo Med's Repti Calcium with D3 is excellent! If Leonard is less than 12 months old, here's what I recommend.

    This so perfect thank you!! I'll remove the heater light and up my house's air temp to 66 during the day for now until I can get another Jump Start temp monitor. He's about 4 inches long by the way. If I only have mealworms and crickets should that be enough for him? Or so I need to go buy larvae too?

    Had our first handling session today after a week of owning him where he didn't try to sprint off so I'm pretty encouraged. Thank you for all your great advice and for taking the time to explain it all to me!

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    Quote Originally Posted by UmphreysMcGee View Post
    This so perfect thank you!! I'll remove the heater light and up my house's air temp to 66 during the day for now until I can get another Jump Start temp monitor. He's about 4 inches long by the way. If I only have mealworms and crickets should that be enough for him? Or so I need to go buy larvae too?

    Had our first handling session today after a week of owning him where he didn't try to sprint off so I'm pretty encouraged. Thank you for all your great advice and for taking the time to explain it all to me!
    You are welcome! Leos are FUN lizards. Let Leonard be your guide as to how much handling.

    This is also very important: Do you have any multivitamins for Leonard? That's in addition to Zoo Med's Repti Calcium with D3.

    Crickets and mealworms give Leonard variety. What are you feeding them? It's important that these feeders eat a good dry diet 24/7, so that they are nutritious for your leo.
    "If you can hear crickets, it's still summer." ;)

    "May the peace that
    You find at the beach
    Follow you home"

    Click: Leo Care Sheet's Table of Contents

    ===> No plain calcium, calcium with D3, or multivitamins inside an enclosure <===

    Oedura castelnaui ~ Lepidodactylus lugubris ~ Phelsuma barbouri ~ Ptychozoon kuhli ~ Cyrtodactylus peguensis zebraicus ~ Phyllurus platurus ~ Eublepharis macularius ~ Correlophus ciliatus ~ (L kimhowelli) ~ (P tigrinus) ~ (P klemmeri) ~ (H garnotii)

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