Two geckos I don't have a species name for

[Sinosauropteryx]

Here are three photos of the two new geckos I got on Monday (Jan 3rd). The first photo was taken with my cellphone because my digital camera wasn't available when I saw the opportunity to take the photo. The second and third photos were taken with my digital camera. The second photo was not of a very good quality - either the camera was moving or the gecko was - but I included it because I figured the more photos I could show, the better the chance this species could be properly identified.

I have already narrowed the species down to a few groups and based on that I was able to figure out from deduction what the geckos need in terms of set-up (woodland, desert, savannah, etc.) and environment (temperature, humidity, etc.), but for the final details I need to know what species they are. I believe I already know what they are but I am posting these photos in this thread to be absolutely sure, so it's not like I went out and bought on impulse something that I didn't know anything about. If in the chance I am wrong about something like the type of enclosure or what I put in it, then I'll change it.

Here they are:

So they are definately not an Oedura species, and probably not a Homopholis species either. Crossobamon Eversmanni was suggested, but I think they are most likely a Ptyodactylus species by the appearance of their faces and feet. Maybe P. Guttatus or P. Puiseuxi, or some other species. They could also be a Cyrtodactylus or Agamura species, though I doubt the latter because of its rarity in the pet trade.

There are two of them, one larger than the other. As was also typed in the Oedura filicipoda thread, if they both turn out to be males then I will put one of them in another enclosure.

I bought the geckos on Monday of this week and they are still getting accustomed to their enclosure so I am going to refrain from taking any more photos of them in the next few days. Since they are so small and get startled easily (not as easily as Pepé though, surprisingly) I am probably going to have to take photos sparngly, but more photos will hopefully follow whenever I get the chance to take them. Until then, based on the photos I have so far, does anyone have any idea as to what species these guys are?

 

[PassPort]

Ptyodactylus guttatus, skinny ones at that. Search the forums for a care sheet or contact Julie Bergman (Gecko Ranch), she just wrote a good article about them for Reptiles Magazine not too long ago.

I used to keep them and really enjoyed them while I had them. Here was my set up:
Arid arboreal desert viv. Sand substrate in a 12x12x18 exo-terra with an UTH, upright pieces of slate placed diagonally against the glass, and a 60watt bulb during daylight hours. Floor of the cage stayed about 80-85F constantly, and it was about 115F under the basking spot. These geckos are from a hot dry climate and that needs to be recreated as best as possible for them to thrive. Mist lightly every other day and feed the **** outta them.

I hate to be the guy that sees the glass half full, but if you don't correct your set up soon and fatten those guys up, they won't make it long. They are hardy geckos that can take a beating, but yours are already very underweight. You might even try a dewormer and checking them for red mites. Sexing them for you will be easy if you can get some clearer photos.

Good luck with a fantastic species

 

[Sinosauropteryx]

Arid arboreal?

Thanks for your reply.

Yeah, I thought they looked awfully skinny too. I bought them that way, unfortunately. It seems to me that the store I bought them from didn't have the right insects to give them. When I asked for small or pinhead crickets, they said they were out of those. The two dozen medium crickets they gave me looked - for the most part - too large for the geckos. I let the crickets loose in the tank and there doesn't seem to be any left, from what I can see, but is there something else I can get instead? Maybe mealworms? I am travelling around Ottawa on Sunday and there is a reptile place there so I'll ask for a few dozen pinheads and place them in some sort of accessable bowl. In the meantime, what should I ask for at my local pet store?

Another question I have: How do you possibly recreate an arid arboreal environment, and especially one in an area that small? I assume doing so involves putting in dried leafless or sclerophytic branches, but then doesn't it become more like a forest or woodland set-up than a desert set-up? Forgive me, but a forest or woodland in a desert doesn't make a lot of sense to me. A patch of scrub or a solitary tree, maybe, but not a forest. And then there is the matter of fitting it into a 15-20 gallon enclosure...I am trying to imagine what that would be like.

If it helps, though, I do have plants in there for them to climb. I can certainly add more. Right now the geckos are both in a tank that registers as a 15 gallon but it has the floorspace of a typical 20 gallon (2'x1') so they should have adequate space to run around. Maybe I could provide more chances for activity by putting some dried branches and more artificial plants in there. It wouldn't look like a forest but it can definately be done.

As for the bit about deworming and red mites, do you think I should plan a vet checkup sometime in the next week? I'll try the dewormer but I would like to know if their condition is serious enough to take them to the vet ASAP. If not, I will probably take them later in the month along with the rest of the lizards.

Thanks for your advice, I will look through the caresheet forums and try contacting Julie. I take it she is a member of this site? I can just send her a PM.

 

[PassPort]

I guess arboreal is technically not the right word, as they don't live in trees, but they are found on cliff and canyon walls. A larger vivarium than 12x12x18 would have been ideal, but I keep many geckos and don't always have room to provide the biggest terraria possible, but it's always enough to keep them comfortable and happy.

Here's a few links to another forum with pics of healthy guttatus in a proper set up, as well as a link to a photo of their natural habitat.

http://static-p4.fotolia.com/jpg/00/05/16/33/400_F_5163395_Y6CjFeOtODuQYM5wWBRCPxSInj2Dk2P9.jpg
Geco ... ? , Forum Natura Mediterraneo | Forum Naturalistico

 

[Sinosauropteryx]

Switching terrariums

Ah OK, I see now. I must have misunderstood what you were trying to say earlier. Thanks for clarifying.

I can definately put in something that resembles a cliff. They are actually two large rocks, one round and one with spiny edges and lots of places under which they could hide if I placed it on the floor of the terrarium. I think I might put in a few more plants, too. This would all be in the tank they are in now.

I have a 12x12x18 inch terrarium but it is currently being occupied by my white-lined gecko (long story, PM me if you want to). In a few months or so, I am moving my green basilisk into a much larger enclosure and Pepé may move into where he/she is living now. That would give me an empty 12x12x18 inch tank to use if my two new geckos really needed a vertical-oriented terrarium.

It would be easier and quicker for me to get a horizontally-oriented tank that went close to 18 inches high...maybe not exactly 18 inches without getting rediculously large horizontal-wise, but it would be near there.

In any case, thanks for all that info on the tank set-up. I have a much better idea what to put in there now.

 

[PassPort]

No plants, unless they're fake, even then I wouldn't use them. These geckos need low humidity levels and live plants would raise it too much.

 

[Sinosauropteryx]

OK, no fake or live plants plants

OK. Thanks for the heads up. I have one fake succulent plant that I think I will leave in there but the others I will take out.

What about their diet? Are these geckos okay on mealworms and the adult beetles or should I be making much more of an effort to get pinhead/small crickets?

 

[PassPort]

medium crickets are fine. don't try worms until they are healthy, as they're likely not to trigger the same feeding response.

 

[Sinosauropteryx]

Problem solved

I managed to get 1/4 size crickets in Ottawa today and I let them go in the tank. I tried using a steep glass bowl but I don't think it worked; I didn't see either of the geckos go in it. In any case, they now have about a dozen mealworms (I know, but I wanted to try them) and I think over two dozen small crickets running around. Both geckos have been spending a lot of time on the side of the glass lately but they do spend some of their time on th ground, either stretched out on one of the rocks or hiding between two of them. These guys seem to prefer camoflauge against the surrounding landscape to hiding in dark places. Which I find a little strange, but oh well.

Sorry about resurrecting that other thread. I thought this board didn't have anything against resurrecting older threads, but if starting new ones is preferred, then I will do that instead.

The photos of P. puiseuxi that I saw all seemed to have lighter spots against darker colours all over the body, from black to dark brown to tawny, and I did not see any that looked like the one in the photocopy I posted so the authors of the book I got it from may have gotten their species wrong. I still haven't contacted those two people you mentioned but I am beginning to agree that the geckos I have are most likely P. guttatus.

In any case, thanks for replying to my OP. This species must be rare amongst members of this site because no one else has posted yet. No biggie, the problem seems to have been solved (for now)

 

[PassPort]

No worries on pulling up an old thread, it's just not always the most effective way of getting your questions answered. Many times people join this forum to get a question answered then forget about it later on, so a lot of times the people who started the original thread aren't even on here anymore. If you want a question answered you're better off starting a new thread.

In regards to the rarity of these species, yes, they are fairly uncommon among keepers. The fact that WC's are so cheap that it makes captive bred babies hard to sell and you can see why there's not a whole lot of people keeping/breeding them, even though they are a delightful species to work with.

I bred guttatus for a few years and I really enjoyed them. I had WC's originally, but only one male out of a group of 4 or so made it, so I set him up with a nice CB female I got from a friend, but sold them a about 2 years ago along with the rest of my desert species when I moved to a smaller apartment.