New Tokay concerns

[cassicat4]

A week ago Tuesday, I acquired a male WC Tokay of unknown age that was shipped to me from across the country.

To save space and a long-winded thread, his setup is essentially the same as my other male, including temperatures and humidity:

http://www.geckosunlimited.com/comm...ed-etc/70886-injured-stressed-sick-tokay.html

The difference being, this one is on peat moss/soil with no paper towel, has more hiding spaces provided by cork logs/flats, and has 2 sides covered with black foam board to prevent him from seeing out.

When I first got him, he was active and exploring his home, often spending time at the front doors and the side of his tank watching me (I didn't have the sides covered up at that time, as he seemed fine with all the foliage for cover). I tried bowl-feeding him, but after Saturday rolled around with no attempts to eat, I offered some free-roaming crickets (with potatoes and carrots for the crickets to munch on) which he did take to. However, as far as I know (based on evidence of feces) is that Saturday (a week ago today) was the last time he ate. It was also the last time I saw him out and about. All of a sudden (on Sunday), he's been hiding constantly. At first it was underneath his cork flat, and thinking he's stressed, I covered up both sides of his tank, and since then, he doesn't hide under his flat, but hides along the side wall of his tank behind his foliage. The few times I have caught him hanging out on the back wall, the minute he saw me, he bolted for cover.

Now I understand he's stressed and will take time to adjust...but is this behavior normal? Or is there something I should be concerned about? It's the fact that he was active and exploring at first, as well as eating, but has now changed completely which is what concerns me.

Nothing in his environment changed. He's in a quiet part of the house (gecko room) with minimal activity.

I haven't made any attempts to go near him, and I only go in his tank to mist, change out his water, and offer food.

However, I don't think he's eating as I find the vast majority of crickets I offer drowned in his water bowl. I also can't find any feces where I first found it, and I know they're usually pretty consistent with where they go.

Is there something else I should be doing to help him come around? Or will he do so on his own, eventually?

As a side note, he was de-wormed by the breeder he came from (his wife is a herp vet) prior to me getting him, so theoretically parasites shouldn't be the cause of this. He also appears (to me) to be of a good weight. He shed the day he arrived as well, so his lack of eating should not be shed-related.

This is my first WC Tokay (my other two were CB and younger when purchased) so I don't have much to relate to as my others adapted very quickly.

I'm trying to upload a pic, but my PC isn't responding, so I'll do so as soon as I can.

Any help/advice would be greatly appreciated!

EDIT: Picture. This is the best I could get without being too intrusive. The white you see on the ground is a piece of leftover shed.

 

[Shadow&Kitten]

about toky zero or toky as hes more commonly refered to

I have never seen him do his buisness any where else aside from at the base of his plant. (I originaly put the plant there because thats where he was doing his buesness to give him some privicy.

He hates airstoned water I replaced the hose 4 times now and still water I already know is pointless hes never liked it just as still water. More about the crickets maybe they are commiting suiside befor your tokay can even hunt them, as they need an airstone or a "splashing" to tell them where the large water is(have not found 1 drownd cricket sence I put the airstone in) However noting that you may also need a second airstone to ward crickets as I currently have 4 airstones running of a split under the stone I use to line his pond.

So I am working on a sort of large water fall for him because he does not seam to like the air hoses and hes gone after an airstone 1 too many times for my liking(thats why they were made inacsessable to him)

As for actual food I found zero does not like sleepy crickets so make sure when you put the crickets in they are highly active(I find agitating the crickets works well) He also likes to play shot for shot with them, and has been known to let crickets live for a day or 4 some times. I also find removing leftovers just makes him mad and makes him do the whole "i am not hungry" when he has not really eaten in the last few days. You might be seen as a compeeting preditor.

Captive breed or in the wild instints are instints the real question is who does your gekko see you as friend compatition or danger?

Oh something that works well for zero is he has what I call a hunting ground. Its a wide open space srounded by folage but the hunting ground its self is with out any where to hide and there are "cricket blinds" scattered threw out the follage over looking the hunting ground.

I am still new to dealing with gekkos in general so I can really only say what works for me then again from what I read of the gekkos I care for now they are "insaine" the only close to ratinal one is my goldie shara.
bob well prefers human interaction almost to a craving and zero has some weird tendincys(atleast I think they are)

 

[billewicz]

You said he was hiding under the cork flat. If that means the cork flat is laying on the ground, pick it up and lean it vertically against some slate or the glass she he can use it as a hide.

Also, floating some cork will help give the crickets a way out of big water bowls. Or you can add some small stones or buy the cricket saver 'balls' to put in the bowl. Any of these will work.

As for him hiding, yeah, it can take several months before a wild caught Tokay will come out on a regular basis. I'm not a fan of blocking out the sides of the enclosure. Put as many vertical hiding places as you want inside, but leave the glass sides open. The more he gets to see you moving about, and not causing him harm, the faster he'll calm down as he gets used to your movement. The blocked out sides means he can't see you until you right in front of the enclosure and that will spook him almost every time because he never saw you coming!

Most of my loose Tokay will come right out on top of one of the enclosures when I'm feeding. You can feed them by hand as they are so used to me coming and going, and working within an inch of their noses.

 

[cassicat4]

The cork flat is leaning against the side at an angle. He either hides underneath it (attached to the bottom, hanging upside down) or flat against the base of it, in the dirt. He hasn't used either of his cork tubes yet though (as far as I know).

Ok that's a good idea with the water bowl solution, I'll add some stones to it now as I have them readily available.

That's good to know. I've always heard they can have difficulty adjusting, but wasn't entirely sure what that would involve. Is there anything I could put along the sides that would make him feel more secure (other than blocking his view)? Any specific types of decor/hides? I noticed that when he had an open view, he spent all of his time in the dirt or underneath the cork flat. Since I put up the boards to block his view, he spends a lot of time attached to the glass near the top of his tank (behind his foliage). I will remove the boards, I just feel bad that he feels so stressed.

Is it also normal for them to not eat for some time as well?

I would love it if this new one ever gets that comfortable with me!

 

[billewicz]

You could just block the small area near the top where he likes to hangout and leave the rest open. Hiding up on the glass is much better than in the dirt.



I use roofing slate to lean up against the glass and then lean the bark against that. Then I'll hang plants all around that. The gap is just enough for them to see out, (And me in!) without disturbing them.

Roofing slate can sometimes be found on Craig's list/building supplies, or from from roofing supply companies. It is much lighter than flooring slate and can be 18" to 24" tall so it works better than 12" tiles.

 

[cassicat4]

That's a great idea! Thanks for the picture! That's exactly what my gecko needs, as seeing me from the side isn't what appears to bother him, it's me seeing him where he sticks on the glass. I will see where I can track some slate down.

 

[billewicz]

That's a great idea! I will see where I can track some slate down.

If you can't find any, drop me a note.

Michael

 

[Aimless]

Is it possible he noticed another gecko after having been there awhile and is afraid/ nervous?

 

[cassicat4]

Is it possible he noticed another gecko after having been there awhile and is afraid/ nervous?

I guess depends on how good his eyesight is? His tank is located on one wall, and the rest of my geckos (including Tokays) are on the opposite wall. Now I have had geckos out for handling at night that he would have been able to see up close (within a few feet of his tank), but they were only crested geckos (I reserve my Tokay handling for daytime, and not in his line of sight). Could he be scared of those? My other two Tokays also don't call in the night, and rarely ever bark, so I wouldn't think he'd be really aware of their presence. It was just bizarre how he seemed to be adjusting just fine, and then acted like something spooked him and he went into hiding.

 

[billewicz]

I've never seen a Tokay scared of another Gecko. I have several smaller gecko species side by side with some of my biggest Tokay, and they hang out and watch the other lizards through their glass.

Now I have had shipments of Tokay come in that are a bit in shock from the trip. They can be on the cool side and showing their colors and not very responsive to stimulation. Once you put them in their new enclosure they may sit there and not move for several hours. Eventually they will retreat to a nice hiding space and start to peek out about dusk.

Now, some years later, most of my original wild caught males are huge and very bold. As soon as I walk in the room, most of my Tokay will come out to see 'what's for dinner'. When I open the enclosure door, typically the male is sitting out at whatever point is closest to the door. They will either jump into the feeding bucket, or leap onto my hand looking for the first cricket or roach. Sometimes I can't get them to go back into their enclosure. They are too busy eating to be scared of me.

Wild caught take a really long time to settle down. The more they get to see you moving about with no ill effects toward them, the fast this will happen.