New Zealand Geckos in the US?
- Thread starter Jateui
- Start date
BlakeDeffenbaugh
New member
There is people here working with them but they are pretty expensive, not very productive, and hard get your hands on. Most of them are sold before they hit open market so you would just have to find someone working with them and get on a list or get lucky and they have some for sale right then. Just be prepared to spend $1-3k per animal or more.
DDReptiles
New member
They are in the US, just the people who keep them don't like to talk about them (this is just from talking to some of them). I think its because talking about them sets off quite a few flags to the authorities, as most of the ones in the US do not come from very legit sources.
Geitje
New member
Actually, I think that most keepers of New Zealand geckos prefer to not talk about them on the forums due to the inevitable and subsequent avalanche of inquiries of people wanting to get them, or opening themselves up to robbery as in the recent case of the guy with Hoplodactylus chrysosireticus (which is COMPLETELY BANNED from export in New Zealand;-)). Even though it is well known that NZ is a bit over the top on the conservation of their native geckos I do not think that weighs into the equation of letting the world know I have them and breed them. Naultinus were only recently added to CITES III (the lowest protection status that equates into virtually nothing) and therefore any animals exchanged do not need any accompanying permits – now or previously. Bringing Naultinus to the USA up until a couple of years ago was about as much work as bringing in a handful of house geckos – at least through the legal channels here in the USA. Just because they are protected in NZ does not mean that these animals have not been exported LEGALLY OUT of NZ and into captivity. I know of multiple instances. It is highly misplaced to think that any floating around are not “from very legit sources” – when they may or may not be. There are keepers who have COLONIES of these and from straight-up, 100% legit sources and have bred them and went on to other keepers – and across into other countries.
The real issue here is that these animals can only produce 1-2 babies each year, are HIGHLY OVER-RATED – yet cool animals, are not banned from import/export (!!!), and the argument of being legit or not is about as important as asking if the Hemidactylus in PetCo are legit or not. Now, I would certainly be interested in knowing more about each animal that was offered to me, but in the real context – it means ABSOLUTELY NOTHING outside of New Zealand. I should emphasize that this argument applies to all species that are currently listed as keepable by NZ – Naultinus grayi and elegans; Hoplodactylus – granunlatus, maculatus and pacificus. If someone is offering you any other species (or keeping them) I would be highly cautious of this individual!
And, just a free piece of advice – do not “invest” in NZ geckos, they are the worst investment for the dollar. There are certain natural laws that apply to return on investment -
• Rule 1: Investment: time and money you put into something.
• Rule 2: Return on Investment: what you hope to get out of your investment and how long it takes to mature.
• Rule 3: Will you really sell them when you wanted them (and even more) in the first place?
• Rule 4: (this is an advanced rule)…Understand the nature of your product and legality.
Personally, I would not “sell” them to someone unless they clearly understood these ideas – because, in my opinion, whenever they “get in a $ jam”, their beloved green geckos are back out on the street to the highest bidder. These are animals that should be kept for the love of it.
Also, I think that most Bavayia are infinitely nicer than Hoplodactylus maculatus and certainly far more productive from an investment standpoint.
Just some ideas,
Jon
The real issue here is that these animals can only produce 1-2 babies each year, are HIGHLY OVER-RATED – yet cool animals, are not banned from import/export (!!!), and the argument of being legit or not is about as important as asking if the Hemidactylus in PetCo are legit or not. Now, I would certainly be interested in knowing more about each animal that was offered to me, but in the real context – it means ABSOLUTELY NOTHING outside of New Zealand. I should emphasize that this argument applies to all species that are currently listed as keepable by NZ – Naultinus grayi and elegans; Hoplodactylus – granunlatus, maculatus and pacificus. If someone is offering you any other species (or keeping them) I would be highly cautious of this individual!
And, just a free piece of advice – do not “invest” in NZ geckos, they are the worst investment for the dollar. There are certain natural laws that apply to return on investment -
• Rule 1: Investment: time and money you put into something.
• Rule 2: Return on Investment: what you hope to get out of your investment and how long it takes to mature.
• Rule 3: Will you really sell them when you wanted them (and even more) in the first place?
• Rule 4: (this is an advanced rule)…Understand the nature of your product and legality.
Personally, I would not “sell” them to someone unless they clearly understood these ideas – because, in my opinion, whenever they “get in a $ jam”, their beloved green geckos are back out on the street to the highest bidder. These are animals that should be kept for the love of it.
Also, I think that most Bavayia are infinitely nicer than Hoplodactylus maculatus and certainly far more productive from an investment standpoint.
Just some ideas,
Jon
DDReptiles
New member
Thanks Jon 
, they should make your post a sticky so people can quit posting about if they are in the US or not; must be a post like this one every month or so on various forums.
, they should make your post a sticky so people can quit posting about if they are in the US or not; must be a post like this one every month or so on various forums.
Geitje
New member
Derek,
You're right. I know we all get tired of seeing the same old topics get beaten to death and re-threaded. I'm not sure how that whole stick thing works as it would be nice to have this New Zealand gecko info more readily available to the interested. Maybe one day people will learn how to utilize the search feature of this site. After all, it takes more time to reconstruct the same discussions than to click the search tab above and type in your search topic! Perhaps a new forum topic of "legal advice" could be implemented so that people are not led too far astray! Seems too many people speculate on topics and the next thing it's spread everywhere. Having such a forum should minimize a lot of people giving the wrong advice!
Jon
You're right. I know we all get tired of seeing the same old topics get beaten to death and re-threaded. I'm not sure how that whole stick thing works as it would be nice to have this New Zealand gecko info more readily available to the interested. Maybe one day people will learn how to utilize the search feature of this site. After all, it takes more time to reconstruct the same discussions than to click the search tab above and type in your search topic! Perhaps a new forum topic of "legal advice" could be implemented so that people are not led too far astray! Seems too many people speculate on topics and the next thing it's spread everywhere. Having such a forum should minimize a lot of people giving the wrong advice!
Jon
LarryLockard
New member
Jon,
Totally agree with you. I think that if you are serious about acquiring Naultinus species or even Hoplodactylus species, you need to realize this is an animal that your going to have to want, not just want to make a profit. That being said, I love them darn little critters. LOL
Totally agree with you. I think that if you are serious about acquiring Naultinus species or even Hoplodactylus species, you need to realize this is an animal that your going to have to want, not just want to make a profit. That being said, I love them darn little critters. LOL
I've actually done a few searches for these and found little to no helpful information. Or the threads were years old and a lot can easily change in that time.
I know very well that these animals don't reproduce very much and are not only very expensive, but hard to get hold of. I wouldn't want to raise and breed them for profit, because it certainly wouldn't be worth it in that time it takes to raise one up, but I'd want to do it because I enjoy it. Yet, I don't want to have 25 or so offspring a year from one pair, since eventually you'd have to sell them if that were the case. But I really enjoy hatching and raising the little guys up.
I know very well that these animals don't reproduce very much and are not only very expensive, but hard to get hold of. I wouldn't want to raise and breed them for profit, because it certainly wouldn't be worth it in that time it takes to raise one up, but I'd want to do it because I enjoy it. Yet, I don't want to have 25 or so offspring a year from one pair, since eventually you'd have to sell them if that were the case. But I really enjoy hatching and raising the little guys up.
Geitje
New member
I think that the helpful information that people such as yourself are looking for is out there, but hard to get for various reasons. The number one reason is that people make a living writing books and getting paid to share their experience and knowledge, not tossing it "out there" on the forums for people to argue with you about. Another problem is that most experienced keepers shy away from forums and sharing hard-earned information because it becomes tedious to put forth so much information and experience accurately into a few words. A lot of that information/experience was hard earned both financially and over a lot of years of trial and error. To toss it out there, like a sidewalk philosopher, whenever someone comes along is hard to rationalize with this in mind. There are not many experienced keepers, and even fewer breeders, of Naultinus. You’re not the first person to come along in the history of this hobby and long to keep these creatures, and my original reply was drafted to make you aware of the inarguable obstacles and facts. These animals will never be common and I’d be as shocked to see these offered “for sale” on this forum as I would some other species like – Rhynchoedura ornata, Colopus kochii, Carphodactylus laevis, Matoatoa spannringii, Coleonyx switaki, Pachydactylus waterbergensis or any other number of highly rare or hard to breed species.
For all of us, we learn as humans that it is necessary to crawl before we walk. Unfortunately, this theoretical fact applies to keeping geckos too. It takes time to gain the abilities necessary to keep some of these animals. There are no entitlements, just because someone has the dough to blow.
Also, it was a little hard for me to follow your statements and I’m not sure you’re referring to NZ geckos any longer? All Naultinus and Hoplodactylus from NZ are live-bearing animals and therefore you cannot hatch ‘em out, let alone get 25 or so offspring a year from one pair. 1-2 if you know what to do.
Peace
Jon
When I meant the 25 or so offspring a year thing, I meant that because that's what I had run into this year. I was told that "first time" females in the species I was working with would have quite a few duds. Yet, they've all been fertile, which quickly stretches the number of spare tanks you have empty.
I've admired the New Zealand geckos for quite some time. I knew for a fact that chances of me finding one would be extremely slim, especially with their price and the fact that there's a lot of other people out there that are also looking for them. I was simply inquiring if there were many known NZ geckos in the united states out of curiosity, since I had only heard of them even mentioned being here maybe only once or twice, and it seems that they were all pretty much in Europe.
I've admired the New Zealand geckos for quite some time. I knew for a fact that chances of me finding one would be extremely slim, especially with their price and the fact that there's a lot of other people out there that are also looking for them. I was simply inquiring if there were many known NZ geckos in the united states out of curiosity, since I had only heard of them even mentioned being here maybe only once or twice, and it seems that they were all pretty much in Europe.
Here, here Jon. Well said. Would be great to see them in some US zoos to satisfy the desire of people to at least be able to see them without having their own (or flying to NZ). Although, I'd kinda prefer the latter - nothing better than seeing (and then leaving) an animal in its natural habitat!