I have successfully bred a variety of Phelsuma and Rhacodactylus species over the years... I have recently found myself the proud new owner of a handful or Tokay morphs... Now, I have never even tried to breed normals but, here goes... First, it seems to me that there are no real leucistic Tokays - With the exception of the ones I had read about, at one point, that were born white. Without going into a crash-course on genetics (which I am hardly qualified to give), wouldn't any albino or leucistic animal have to be born lacking that pigment? The reason I ask this is because the tokay morphs are born looking like a normal tokay hatchling. Then, they develop totally normal looking and if they are going to change at all... They turn Granite... Then possibly Calico... Then possibly all white. This confuses me. I Have a 1.1 pair are "True" Leucistics with the silvery-gray eyes. But they still have a few faint, small spots of color that may or may not fade away. I have another 1.1 pair that started off as Granites. The female is now Calico and the male is a lovely Granite with a peach head. I also have another lone male that started off as a Granite - All grayish-brown. Now, he is mostly white with a peach head and patches of light gray with black spots. I also have another lone male that is all white with brown eyes. Needless to say, I an looking for two females. Frankly, I am not that concerned what morph they are, since it is all clearly the same gene. Right? I also have one hatchling from the "Leucistic" pair. And two more hatchlings from a friends Calico X Calico pair... Here's what I am really wondering... Other than the confusion about exactly what I am going to produce (Normal, Het, Morph?)... I am really wondering if anyone knows what the offspring will be worth? I realize that they are worth more if I hold them back and let them completely morph into whatever they are going to be... But what about the Hets? If I can show pictures of the parents, but the baby is totally normal.. Well, you get the idea... I think. I really cannot find too many captive bred Tokay morphs to get a frame of reference... Anyone?
Tokay Morphs... Pricing?
- Thread starter Jonny
- Start date
Riverside Reptiles
Administrator (HMFIC)
There's not always a simple "market value". Value on something like that depends on what someone else is willing to pay. It's whatever the market will bear. Like with any other animal, reputation of the breeder, quality of the animal, age, sex determination, rarity, all come into play. Plus, as you mentioned, with this particular morph, the amount of visual development of the morph affects the value as well. I tend to not talk publicly much about pricing as what today's price might be, could change tomorrow. And the last thing that I want to do is devalue the market for a particular animal/morph. Doing so does not make many friends among fellow breeders!
As for the "leucistics", you might want to talk to David (Ophidiophile). He owns one that looks like it might actually be a "real" leucistic. Terms like "leucistic" are often thrown around by breeders. Patternless leopard geckos were, for a long time, called "leucistics" also despite obviously not being a "real" leucistic. Some people still call them that. Not to say that it's not a real morph...simply not what the scientific community would consider an actual leucistic. I have a handful of cb calico x calico babies. None are old enough to have started changing yet though. At this point, if I were to sell them, I would simply sell them as what they are...calico x calico w/ no guarantee as to what they're going to turn into. There's still a lot of work to be done w/ these tokay morphs to determine how the genetics behind them really work. Anyone getting into them as a project should be aware (or made aware) of that.
As for the "leucistics", you might want to talk to David (Ophidiophile). He owns one that looks like it might actually be a "real" leucistic. Terms like "leucistic" are often thrown around by breeders. Patternless leopard geckos were, for a long time, called "leucistics" also despite obviously not being a "real" leucistic. Some people still call them that. Not to say that it's not a real morph...simply not what the scientific community would consider an actual leucistic. I have a handful of cb calico x calico babies. None are old enough to have started changing yet though. At this point, if I were to sell them, I would simply sell them as what they are...calico x calico w/ no guarantee as to what they're going to turn into. There's still a lot of work to be done w/ these tokay morphs to determine how the genetics behind them really work. Anyone getting into them as a project should be aware (or made aware) of that.
Tokay Morphs, pricing, genetic crapshoot, etc...
Hi Ethan,
Thanks for your response... I guess we will all have to just wait and see what happens. I have been trying to educate myself on genetics. It truly is foreign to me... I have never worked with any species of snakes... Nor Leopard Geckos or Bearded Dragons... Only Phelsuma and Rhacodacylus. Even the Cresteds are just for fun, without trying to produce anything fancy. So, I have never needed to pay attention. Based on what I have read about, say for example, Ball Pythons... Breeding two animals that display the desired traits should produce ALL offspring with those traits... By taking one animal with the traits and breeding it with one that is positively Het for those traits should produce half of the desired looking offspring and half 100% Het for the gene. I think? But this has yet to be proven? I guess I really, really would love to see how your Calico/Calico hatchlings turn out. Please keep us posted!
Hi Ethan,
Thanks for your response... I guess we will all have to just wait and see what happens. I have been trying to educate myself on genetics. It truly is foreign to me... I have never worked with any species of snakes... Nor Leopard Geckos or Bearded Dragons... Only Phelsuma and Rhacodacylus. Even the Cresteds are just for fun, without trying to produce anything fancy. So, I have never needed to pay attention. Based on what I have read about, say for example, Ball Pythons... Breeding two animals that display the desired traits should produce ALL offspring with those traits... By taking one animal with the traits and breeding it with one that is positively Het for those traits should produce half of the desired looking offspring and half 100% Het for the gene. I think? But this has yet to be proven? I guess I really, really would love to see how your Calico/Calico hatchlings turn out. Please keep us posted!
wyatt003
New member
This may help you out, i had some of the same questions about percentages and morphs- New England Reptile Distributors, designer Ball Pythons, Reticulated Pythons, and much more!