New rescue super thin. Advice please?

[SamanthaLovely]

I do have a picture I took today but it's talking a long time to upload. When it gets uploaded I'll post it. Her belly is looking a little bigger now. We've been feeding her small crickets most of the time but I think I larg one must have gotten thrown in by accident. She's also been having small silk worms and baby horn worms occasionally.

 

[cricket4u]

I do have a picture I took today but it's talking a long time to upload. When it gets uploaded I'll post it. Her belly is looking a little bigger now. We've been feeding her small crickets most of the time but I think I larg one must have gotten thrown in by accident. She's also been having small silk worms and baby horn worms occasionally.

So you have no idea how old Frodo is right? No history? Adults have a less chance of survival when they are that emaciated due to liver and kidney damage caused by dehydration and starvation. The worst part is not knowing if she has cryptosporidium or not. Chances are her gut organisms are depleted and that alone will cause problems digesting. Due to the fact she has been regurgitation I would avoid the hornworms for now. Silkworms would be more ideal due to their soft body. I would also lessen the chitin by only giving her the body of the cricket, of course that is if she will eat from tongs. It is not easy rehabilitating a gecko that thin without perfect husbandry and guidelines. Make sure you are using quality gutload, like T-Rex high calcium. It's easy to oversupplement a gecko in that condition.

 

[SamanthaLovely]

So you have no idea how old Frodo is right? No history? Adults have a less chance of survival when they are that emaciated due to liver and kidney damage caused by dehydration and starvation. The worst part is not knowing if she has cryptosporidium or not. Chances are her gut organisms are depleted and that alone will cause problems digesting. Due to the fact she has been regurgitation I would avoid the hornworms for now. Silkworms would be more ideal due to their soft body. I would also lessen the chitin by only giving her the body of the cricket, of course that is if she will eat from tongs. It is not easy rehabilitating a gecko that thin without perfect husbandry and guidelines. Make sure you are using quality gutload, like T-Rex high calcium. It's easy to oversupplement a gecko in that condition.

Will a fecal show if she has crypto? She's only regurgitated the once so far and her stool doesn't have undigested pieces in it anymore. Hopefully it was just that the cricket was too big. I'll pick her up some little silkworms tomorrow but I don't think she'll eat half a cricket from the tongs. I could try to mush it and use the syringe?

I don't know how old she is but her head is quite smaller than all my adult ones so I'm going to assume she's younger but I really have no idea.

I was using the T-Rex gutload but they don't stock it anymore. I've been using the Fluker's cricket feed. And I've been dusting them with plain calcium every time and calcium with D3 once a week.

Before: He's a trooper. | Flickr - Photo Sharing!
Now: Little sweetie. | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

 

[cricket4u]

Will a fecal show if she has crypto? She's only regurgitated the once so far and her stool doesn't have undigested pieces in it anymore. Hopefully it was just that the cricket was too big. I'll pick her up some little silkworms tomorrow but I don't think she'll eat half a cricket from the tongs. I could try to mush it and use the syringe?

I don't know how old she is but her head is quite smaller than all my adult ones so I'm going to assume she's younger but I really have no idea.

I was using the T-Rex gutload but they don't stock it anymore. I've been using the Fluker's cricket feed. And I've been dusting them with plain calcium every time and calcium with D3 once a week.

Before: He's a trooper. | Flickr - Photo Sharing!
Now: Little sweetie. | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

His skin looks better. Make sure you let the vet know you want him to be tested for crypto so that they run a more sensitive test like an IFA. That wesite just reminded me, I would have preferred to provide him with balanced and easy to digest food as Oxbow for about a week or two instead of solid food. I did not want it to come from me and was hoping the vet would have suggested it. Ask the vet to see if she/he thinks it's appropriate for Frodo's situation.
Here is some info:
Arizona Exotic Animal Hospital

 

[SamanthaLovely]

His skin looks better. Make sure you let the vet know you want him to be tested for crypto so that they run a more sensitive test like an IFA. That wesite just reminded me, I would have preferred to provide him with balanced and easy to digest food as Oxbow for about a week or two instead of solid food. I did not want it to come from me and was hoping the vet would have suggested it. Ask the vet to see if she/he thinks it's appropriate for Frodo's situation.
Here is some info:
Arizona Exotic Animal Hospital

So it's just a matter of taking in a fecal to the vet when I take in the other two for their appointment?

When I went in with Frodo the first time she told me not to worry about eating for a few weeks and she said I didn't need to bother with the Repta+Boost unless I wanted too. She said to get her on solid food. I used the Repta+Boost at my own discretion becasue I figured solid food would have been a shock to her system if she was indeed not eating before I got her.
I can ask what she thinks but she'll probably tell me to stick with solid food.

 

[cricket4u]

When I went in with Frodo the first time she told me not to worry about eating for a few weeks

That's shocking that she will allow an emaciated reptile to continue without food. Well just continue with the insects. She is the vet and Frodo is under her care.

 

[SamanthaLovely]

I'm putting her back on the liquid food for a while because her stool had some partly undigested silk worms in it and I don't want her to have to stress about that while she's recovering.

 

[cricket4u]

I'm putting her back on the liquid food for a while because her stool had some partly undigested silk worms in it and I don't want her to have to stress about that while she's recovering.

I would get a fecal done asap to make sure she is not getting treated for the wrong thing. This should have been done from the beginning. Your vet should have clearly suggested that you bring in a fecal sample. Fenbendazole does not treat all parasites and there is a chance of crypto, bacterial infection or other organisms. If the load is high you can feed all you want to, but she will fail to put on weight.

 

[SamanthaLovely]

I would get a fecal done asap to make sure she is not getting treated for the wrong thing. This should have been done from the beginning. Your vet should have clearly suggested that you bring in a fecal sample. Fenbendazole does not treat all parasites and there is a chance of crypto, bacterial infection or other organisms. If the load is high you can feed all you want to, but she will fail to put on weight.

I will get it done as soon as I can.

 

[XoVictoryXo]

she is def looking a little better, I hope she makes a full recovery soon! you are doing a great job!

 

[cricket4u]

I will get it done as soon as I can.

I also meant to ask you. Your not taking her out of her tank daily are you? It will be best if she is not pulled out at all at this point. That is truly stressful and can play a negative role in her gut flora.

 

[SamanthaLovely]

I also meant to ask you. Your not taking her out of her tank daily are you? It will be best if she is not pulled out at all at this point. That is truly stressful and can play a negative role in her gut flora.

I'm trying my best not to pick her up or disturb her at all but some days she won't eat the liquid food unless I pick her up.

 

[SamanthaLovely]

she is def looking a little better, I hope she makes a full recovery soon! you are doing a great job!

Thanks for your support We're doing our best!

 

[SamanthaLovely]

It doesn't look so good tonight. There was blood in her tank. It looked like she was trying to go to the bathroom because there were urates in it. She had gone to the bathroom earlier today and I removed it. It looked pretty normal, small and still slightly runny but more solid than before. She's lost weight too. She weighs 16 grams by my scale. The closest appointment they could get me was friday. But since I've found the blood I'm calling the vet in the morning and telling her she needs to see me.

 

[cricket4u]

It doesn't look so good tonight. There was blood in her tank. It looked like she was trying to go to the bathroom because there were urates in it. She had gone to the bathroom earlier today and I removed it. It looked pretty normal, small and still slightly runny but more solid than before. She's lost weight too. She weighs 16 grams by my scale. The closest appointment they could get me was friday. But since I've found the blood I'm calling the vet in the morning and telling her she needs to see me.

I was hoping not to hear the news you are giving and why I kept bringing up the fecal. I would not feed any solids if I were you. Poor little one. I am a little upset at the fact that the vet did not do further testing sooner which can make a difference between life or death. If for example she has a bacterial infection or coccidia and was treated with the correct medication a she could have been improving by now. It makes me furious that a vet will just throw one type of dewormer to an emaciated gecko without getting a fecal exam to make sure she is treating the right thing. Now she has entered a more serious stage which decreases her chances of survival greatly.

 

[SamanthaLovely]

I was hoping not to hear the news you are giving and why I kept bringing up the fecal. I would not feed any solids if I were you. Poor little one. I am a little upset at the fact that the vet did not do further testing sooner which can make a difference between life or death. If for example she has a bacterial infection or coccidia and was treated with the correct medication a she could have been improving by now. It makes me furious that a vet will just throw one type of dewormer to an emaciated gecko without getting a fecal exam to make sure she is treating the right thing. Now she has entered a more serious stage which decreases her chances of survival greatly.

I feel so bad because I couldn't get to the vets office to drop off a sample. I feel like I've failed her. I don't think I'll be able to sleep tonight. If she had gone to the bathroom before the first time I would have automatically brought in a fecal. I wish my vet wasn't so far away. God, I feel like a terrible person.

 

[XoVictoryXo]

Oh dear keep us posted. You are far from a horrible person, you rescued and are trying to save this poor girl. Dont beat yourself up!

 

[aquamentus_11]

yeah, it's strange: the vet went ahead and assumed that worms were the problem and blindly treated for them, but didn't empirically treat for protozoans. it's one thing to operate that way when you have to wait for fecal results, but to treat empirically without trying to get an ID is just lazy and sloppy imo. there's always the possibility that the anti-protozoal drugs are too risky to give to geckos without a positive ID, but then you'd expect an effort to make one....

 

[aquamentus_11]

btw, i think i agree with cricket: some sort of coccidiosis could fit what you're describing. don't be frightened by a little blood, she's not dead yet. you've gotten her this far just by guttin' it out; imagine how you'll do with proper medication. go to the vet, tell him you want her to get some fluids and that you think it could be some sort of coccidiosis (cox-ID-ee-osis), but you're not sure because she's only had one round of dewormer. if you already knew how to pronounce coccidiosis, don't be offended that i did that; i've heard so many different pronunciations and he'll respect you more if you say it correctly. it's obvious that he's not treating this as seriously as he should be so some jargon might get his attention. ask him about another fecal and whether empirical treatment with metronidazole is safe. if not, ask what sort of empirical treatment he would recommend. get there today. i have a huge amount of confidence in you and i'll be pulling for her today.

 

[cricket4u]

yeah, it's strange: the vet went ahead and assumed that worms were the problem and blindly treated for them, but didn't empirically treat for protozoans. it's one thing to operate that way when you have to wait for fecal results, but to treat empirically without trying to get an ID is just lazy and sloppy imo. there's always the possibility that the anti-protozoal drugs are too risky to give to geckos without a positive ID, but then you'd expect an effort to make one....

It's so frustrating at times. The right thing to do is suggest to the OP to follow the vet's recommendation and to continue following up, although we have our doubts on the vet's decisions.

Samantha you are far from a bad person. You have good intentions overall. The problem is rehabilitating takes lots of effort, finances and time. Most people want to save lives, but in reality it's not for everyone. Keep us posted.