New rescue super thin. Advice please?

[aquamentus_11]

It's so frustrating at times. The right thing to do is suggest to the OP to follow the vet's recommendation and to continue following up, although we have our doubts on the vet's decisions.

Samantha you are far from a bad person. You have good intentions overall. The problem is rehabilitating takes lots of effort, finances and time. Most people want to save lives, but in reality it's not for everyone. Keep us posted.

from my experience, vets are usually very caring, very intelligent people with their hearts in the right place, but after years of anything anyone can become a little hardened.

btw, cricket, it's the same for us as med students when the attending says something we disagree with. it's hard not to step in, but undermining them = VERBAL DECAPITATION

 

[SamanthaLovely]

yeah, it's strange: the vet went ahead and assumed that worms were the problem and blindly treated for them, but didn't empirically treat for protozoans. it's one thing to operate that way when you have to wait for fecal results, but to treat empirically without trying to get an ID is just lazy and sloppy imo. there's always the possibility that the anti-protozoal drugs are too risky to give to geckos without a positive ID, but then you'd expect an effort to make one....

I was thinking of that too but not being a vet or knowing anything (I will try to remedy that one day) I thought maybe there were some outward signs I didn't see because I didn't recognise them as signs. I'm hoping it was a generic low dosage medicine that didn't do damage to her. But she was seeming to do better before her second dose :/

 

[aquamentus_11]

I was thinking of that too but not being a vet or knowing anything (I will try to remedy that one day) I thought maybe there were some outward signs I didn't see because I didn't recognise them as signs. I'm hoping it was a generic low dosage medicine that didn't do damage to her. But she was seeming to do better before her second dose :/

oh she did have 2? well, it may not have been the dewormer that did this. if it's a protozoan and not a worm, then the drug was probably ineffective and this could just be normal progression of the infection.

 

[SamanthaLovely]

I was hoping not to hear the news you are giving and why I kept bringing up the fecal. I would not feed any solids if I were you. Poor little one. I am a little upset at the fact that the vet did not do further testing sooner which can make a difference between life or death. If for example she has a bacterial infection or coccidia and was treated with the correct medication a she could have been improving by now. It makes me furious that a vet will just throw one type of dewormer to an emaciated gecko without getting a fecal exam to make sure she is treating the right thing. Now she has entered a more serious stage which decreases her chances of survival greatly.

There are two exotic vets at my vets office, Dr. Yan and Dr. Chamberlain. When I first went in with Kalahari and Sahara I saw Dr. Yan. Both came home fine aside from nightmares about the vet. When I took Frodo in I saw Dr. Chamberlain. Today at 4 I'll be seeing Dr. Yan. So hopefully seeing the other vet will give a different opinion with Frodo will yield better results.

 

[SamanthaLovely]

btw, i think i agree with cricket: some sort of coccidiosis could fit what you're describing. don't be frightened by a little blood, she's not dead yet. you've gotten her this far just by guttin' it out; imagine how you'll do with proper medication. go to the vet, tell him you want her to get some fluids and that you think it could be some sort of coccidiosis (cox-ID-ee-osis), but you're not sure because she's only had one round of dewormer. if you already knew how to pronounce coccidiosis, don't be offended that i did that; i've heard so many different pronunciations and he'll respect you more if you say it correctly. it's obvious that he's not treating this as seriously as he should be so some jargon might get his attention. ask him about another fecal and whether empirical treatment with metronidazole is safe. if not, ask what sort of empirical treatment he would recommend. get there today. i have a huge amount of confidence in you and i'll be pulling for her today.

I'm going to memorize this and do some research to understand it more. Then I can go it and just tell them what I want them to do

 

[SamanthaLovely]

It's so frustrating at times. The right thing to do is suggest to the OP to follow the vet's recommendation and to continue following up, although we have our doubts on the vet's decisions.

Samantha you are far from a bad person. You have good intentions overall. The problem is rehabilitating takes lots of effort, finances and time. Most people want to save lives, but in reality it's not for everyone. Keep us posted.

It is hard but there's really nothing better that I could be doing besides helping these little guys. I've got alot of financial support from my family when I need it. And I certainly do with the 4 vet appointments these last two months. I'll also be getting everyone's fecals done over the course of the next few pay checks.

 

[SamanthaLovely]

oh she did have 2? well, it may not have been the dewormer that did this. if it's a protozoan and not a worm, then the drug was probably ineffective and this could just be normal progression of the infection.

Yes. I don't know if it was divided into two because she couldn't handle it all at once but the vet said it was a dewormer. All the label said was Safe-Guard Suspension. I'll be getting the name of it when I go in today.

 

[aquamentus_11]

haha i'm not a vet. i deal with humans and i'm not even good at that yet. i just wanted to give you some things to bring up. hopefully, dr. yan does them anyway. good to hear you've got the better doc lined up. from experience, i can tell you that if you ask him about all the things i suggested, he'll be much more impressed and ready to help than if you tell him what you want lol. i have a good feeling about this. could just be all the coffee....

 

[aquamentus_11]

Yes. I don't know if it was divided into two because she couldn't handle it all at once but the vet said it was a dewormer. All the label said was Safe-Guard Suspension. I'll be getting the name of it when I go in today.

it's standard for some dewormers to be given a few weeks apart

 

[SamanthaLovely]

haha i'm not a vet. i deal with humans and i'm not even good at that yet. i just wanted to give you some things to bring up. hopefully, dr. yan does them anyway. good to hear you've got the better doc lined up. from experience, i can tell you that if you ask him about all the things i suggested, he'll be much more impressed and ready to help than if you tell him what you want lol. i have a good feeling about this. could just be all the coffee....

I hope so she seemed very knowledgeable when I saw her. This is part of her little biography blerb from their website.

"Dr. Lilla Yan grew up in Mississauga and is a graduate of OntarioVeterinaryCollege. She joined us in the spring of 2010 as a full-time veterinarian. Dr. Yan sees dogs, cats as well as your scaly, feathery or furry friends. She has worked with avian and exotic pets extensively and has been trained by some of the world’s experts on these animals. She believes every pet is special, no matter how small they are."

I definitely feel more confident about the appointment after reading it.

 

[cricket4u]

It is hard but there's really nothing better that I could be doing besides helping these little guys. I've got alot of financial support from my family when I need it. And I certainly do with the 4 vet appointments these last two months. I'll also be getting everyone's fecals done over the course of the next few pay checks.

I'm just so glad to hear she is being seen. Go prepared this time with questions. Take a notepad and write down what he says. Ask with confidence and make sure he answers all your questions. Do you have a heat source to keep her warm?

 

[cricket4u]

Taking them to the vet is another challenge and quite stressful and so keeping them warm is important. The drop in temperature along with stress can really effect her immune system which she cannot afford. A heat lamp will be best. They will allow you to plug it up right over the exam table. They understand how important it is to keep her warm. I know people who have carried the whole tank to the vets office.:lol:

Where you able to collect a fecal sample to take?

 

[aquamentus_11]

cricket, i wondered about that in the past. would wrapping her in a heat pad (human version) be ok? i don't think they get too hot if you get the dialable kind.

 

[SamanthaLovely]

Taking them to the vet is another challenge and quite stressful and so keeping them warm is important. The drop in temperature along with stress can really effect her immune system which she cannot afford. A heat lamp will be best. They will allow you to plug it up right over the exam table. They understand how important it is to keep her warm. I know people who have carried the whole tank to the vets office.:lol:

Where you able to collect a fecal sample to take?

I have a 10 gallon I'm going to take her in. Taking my moms car again with the heated seats. I don't have a sample to take in yet but I'm hoping by the time 2:30 rolls around she'll have produced me one. I'm debating giving her a little bit of the warmed liquid food to encourage it. There's normally a little stool in there for me to clean every morning but apparently not this morning when I need it :/

 

[cricket4u]

cricket, i wondered about that in the past. would wrapping her in a heat pad (human version) be ok? i don't think they get too hot if you get the dialable kind.

That would have been fine as long as you have a source to check the temp on it. The whole tank is a better option, if size allows it.:biggrin:

 

[cricket4u]

I have a 10 gallon I'm going to take her in. Taking my moms car again with the heated seats. I don't have a sample to take in yet but I'm hoping by the time 2:30 rolls around she'll have produced me one. I'm debating giving her a little bit of the warmed liquid food to encourage it. There's normally a little stool in there for me to clean every morning but apparently not this morning when I need it :/

If you have one take a heat lamp because once they pull her out to examine her the room might be cold. At least this way she will have warm over her on the table. I know some people will feel embarrassed to pull out a heat lamp, but trust me it's a good sign from your part. It would have been nice if they provided at least a little table heater in the room.

That is always the case, when you need them to poop they don't. I know you need the feces, but I would not because she can regurgitate and the acid will irritate her lining even more. The vet can swab her rectum or use another method if needed. The stress and handling normally makes them defecate on the vet. Let's hope so.:lol:

I would lean in her tank and with a syringe try to get her to lick up some water. She needs the hydration and it can also help her bowels move.

 

[aquamentus_11]

so, how did it go?

 

[SamanthaLovely]

So the vet said that the prognosis is not very good. Basically she's assuming the worst which would be crypto. Since I didn't have a sample it was a pretty useless trip. I sent in the fecals for my other two though so something came out of it.

The vet actually asked me if I wanted to bother treating her. I wouldn't have driven the hour and a half if I didn't want to treat her. Basically I need to take in a fecal is what she said. Also if Frodo is eating live food to go ahead and feed her that. On the plus side her organs look normal and her heart is working fine.

As soon as I can get the fecal (TOMORROW HOPEFULLY) I will take it in. I'm hoping the results from the two who were with her can shed some light on the situation. Hopefully it will encourage the vet to let me treat her even if it is crypto. Because she said if it is crypto to euthanize her. I'd like to try and treat her even if she needs to take medicine everyweek. Unless she is in pain.

She's so much alive even being so small. I can't imagine her having something that can't be fixed. Not with her little happy attitude.

I just want to do my best for her.

 

[cricket4u]

Well, I was not expecting good news. I have been in your shoes and I know it's a tough decision to make. Let me know what you decide. At this point it's not confirmed and so I would continue to give it your all. Personally I would not feed solid food for a while.

 

[SamanthaLovely]

Well, I was not expecting good news. I have been in your shoes and I know it's a tough decision to make. Let me know what you decide. At this point it's not confirmed and so I would continue to give it your all. Personally I would not feed solid food for a while.

Well we'll see what happens with the fecal. It's odd that she hasn't gone to the bathroom yet.