Leopard Gecko (Eublepharis macularius) squinting with seemingly no real cause

[LindsayMayer]

Leopard Gecko (Eublepharis macularius) Randall General Questions Thread

Okay, so I'm a new leo parent, starting today actually! He is my first reptile. I bought him from a friend who is moving and cannot take him with, so I was happy to take him. I've been doing substantial research and I feel confident about it all. It is kind of like being a new parent though, you worry about every little thing. Anyway, I went to feed him and noticed he didn't even touch his food. He has also been squinting a lot. He is in shed but when he opens his eyes there don't seem to be any problems. They look healthy and normal. Do they sometimes just do that? I put several crickets in his tank but he didn't even acknowledge them. He was also walking around with his eyes squinted/shut. It's weird. I asked my friend about his eating and he said he had eaten quite a lot last time he ate (Thursday, today's Saturday) so he might not be that hungry. I'm also thinking it might just be the fact that he's in a new place. He was also fed mealworms before, so maybe he doesn't realize they are food? But it's the eyes I'm mostly worried about. He is active and curious otherwise, so I don't see anything visibly wrong with him. He was fine earlier, his eyes were still only a little squinty but mostly open. I think I might be just overworrying when I really shouldn't be Like I said he's also in shed so maybe he's going to start shedding soon, and it's annoying his eyes or something? I have no idea. Hah. Help would be appreciated! Thanks

 

[thorrshamri]

You are right, geckos need some time after a change such as a new enclosure to start feeding again.
The main thing here is all about shedding. Do you have a "shedding box/moist hide" inside its enclosure? The shed on geckos usually takes no more than a few hours to go. You might attempt to give your gecko a 30 min. to 1h lukewarm bath in a shallow container, the water should not be more than 1" deep and around 85°F so as to soften old shed. You will then be able to remove stuck shed fairly easily. If shed remains on its eyes, be extremely careful as trying to remove it might damage its cornea.

 

[bud1988]

Leo's will squint one eye sometimes if a light is too bright.

Also, they will squint one eye sometimes to focus there vision.

 

[LindsayMayer]

Bud, right now I am using a red bulb for night time for a few weeks until I can get my hands on an under-tank heater and experiment with that. It's also quite dim in my room so I'm sure that the brightness of the light is not an issue

Thorr, the thing is, this is his same enclosure. Maybe it's just the surrounding environment -- different smells, lights, etc. I'm sure that would also count as a "new environment". And I do have a moist hide, although looking at it now it might not be the best location... it's a fake tree stump, with four entrances and a couple of holes in the sides. Maybe it's too open for humidity to collect? I put additional warm, moist paper towels in the bottom of it and he seems to go in it, as well as walk through the shallow warm water dish I gave him since I noticed he is in shed (separate from his water dish, which is smaller). He hasn't actually begun shedding yet, though. Should I use a tupperware with a hole cut in it instead? Might hold moisture better.

How long from the time they become quite white/pale to the time they begin their shed, approximately? Or does that vary?

Also, I know they're nocturnal, but do they "sleep" at night at all? He seems to be sleeping now. I'm kind of worried about this little guy. My friend said he was about a year old, his best guess at least. But he seems awfully small for that, who knows how old he is. He seems tiny. He is active and curious but he is just small. I'll post pictures soon. His legs could do to gain some weight on them... naturally like I said I'm worried about every little thing. I am wondering if he has the early stages of MBD... But I could be overreacting, too, and he could be small because he's young. It's just hard when you're not always sure what to expect. I appreciate all advice

 

[thorrshamri]

Taking a break while feeding my own geckos to answer you :biggrin:

Thorr, the thing is, this is his same enclosure. Maybe it's just the surrounding environment -- different smells, lights, etc. I'm sure that would also count as a "new environment". And I do have a moist hide, although looking at it now it might not be the best location... it's a fake tree stump, with four entrances and a couple of holes in the sides. Maybe it's too open for humidity to collect? I put additional warm, moist paper towels in the bottom of it and he seems to go in it, as well as walk through the shallow warm water dish I gave him since I noticed he is in shed (separate from his water dish, which is smaller). He hasn't actually begun shedding yet, though. Should I use a tupperware with a hole cut in it instead? Might hold moisture better.

Yes, a simple change of PLACE even with the same tank could induce some stress, as well as the travel to your home.
Your moist hide does not seem well adapted. The tupperware solution, with just one entrance/exit through a hole barely big enough for your gecko to come and go is a much better idea. You are correct, your current "moist hide" must dry up too fast due to too muh ventilation. Put some materials which will not easily dry up in that new moist hide such as slightly wet moss, or even a piece of natural sponge (no colorings or chemicals of course!).

How long from the time they become quite white/pale to the time they begin their shed, approximately? Or does that vary?

Usually, no more than a few hours. Stress caused by travelling and/or the new place might expain that "abnormal" shed

Also, I know they're nocturnal, but do they "sleep" at night at all? I'm kind of worried about this little guy. My friend said he was about a year old, his best guess at least. But he seems awfully small for that, who knows how old he is. He seems tiny. He is active and curious but he is just small. I'll post pictures soon. His legs could do to gain some weight on them... naturally like I said I'm worried about every little thing. I am wondering if he has the early stages of MBD... But I could be overreacting, too, and he could be small because he's young. It's just hard when you're not always sure what to expect. I appreciate all advice

How big is he? Can you notice any deformation of the spine, legs or jaw?
They don't really "sleep" like we do- they have more or less active periods over 24 hours, most of the time is spent by "taking some rest" (I actually don't like comparisons with humans or more evolved pets as reptiles are VERY different from us in many aspects- just my old habit to be annoying :biggrin: )

 

[LindsayMayer]

Yes, a simple change of PLACE even with the same tank could induce some stress, as well as the travel to your home.
Your moist hide does not seem well adapted. The tupperware solution, with just one entrance/exit through a hole barely big enough for your gecko to come and go is a much better idea. You are correct, your current "moist hide" must dry up too fast due to too muh ventilation. Put some materials which will not easily dry up in that new moist hide such as slightly wet moss, or even a piece of natural sponge (no colorings or chemicals of course!).

Usually, no more than a few hours. Stress caused by travelling and/or the new place might expain that "abnormal" shed

As it happens, I have some dishwashing sponges that are dye-free and still in the original packaging, that could work, yes?
Also, if he hasn't started or completed his shed tomorrow or monday, should I then intervene?

How big is he? Can you notice any deformation of the spine, legs or jaw?
They don't really "sleep" like we do- they have more or less active periods over 24 hours, most of the time is spent by "taking some rest" (I actually don't like comparisons with humans or more evolved pets as reptiles are VERY different from us in many aspects- just my old habit to be annoying :biggrin: )

He is not very big for his age... I asked my friend and he said he believes he is around a year old but of course I can't be sure at all. I feel like he can't be a year old. Or maybe he was malnourished during a key point of growth or something. I haven't measured him but he's in the ballpark of about 5". His tail really isn't skinny, he just looks juvenile. Not a year old, from all of the pictures I've seen online. He doesn't seem overly skinny, his tail doesn't seem skinny... And I totally understand, I'm just new to this whole thing. Correct me as you will!

I've attached some pictures, they're not the best for showing off anything about him but they were from earlier and I don't want to disturb him anymore for today. Hopefully this can give some ideas.

 

[bud1988]

Lindsay, i bought a infared red bulb and my Leo HATED it. She would squint her eyes and move to a place with some coverage (not a hide just plants, ect..)

Then i bought a 75W purple night-time bulb and she isn't bothered by it at all.

Just give your Leo time to settle and get rid of the red bulb (return it) and swap it with a blue or purple night-time light.

 

[bud1988]

Does he have any discharge coming out of his nose or eyes?

 

[LindsayMayer]

Lindsay, i bought a infared red bulb and my Leo HATED it. She would squint her eyes and move to a place with some coverage (not a hide just plants, ect..)

Then i bought a 75W purple night-time bulb and she isn't bothered by it at all.

Just give your Leo time to settle and get rid of the red bulb (return it) and swap it with a blue or purple night-time light.

Does he have any discharge coming out of his nose or eyes?

I got the gecko from a friend, so he came with bulbs... a blue day reptile bulb and a red nighttime one... interestingly enough. I am going in a few weeks to visit my sister, who has an under-tank heater, so I think for now, I will just use the red bulb to minimize the strain on his eyes, if anything. I'm going to experiment with using the under-tank heater; hopefully it heats the tank to the proper temperature. However I've also read that you can use bulbs and under tank heaters in conjunction if the UTH doesn't heat sufficiently, and also that day lights can help with the circadian rhythm of the gecko; is this right?

Also, no, his eyes and nose are clear.

Thorr, I made a new moist hide out of a tupperware (which my mother reluctantly allowed me to do, haha). Not the prettiest thing but it gets the job done He's already exploring it.

 

[bud1988]

You need a Under tank heater For-Sure!

Leo's depend on "belly" heat in order to digest there food.

On the warm side, the Ground Temp should range between *88-93 F.

 

[LindsayMayer]

You need a Under tank heater For-Sure!

Leo's depend on "belly" heat in order to digest there food.

On the warm side, the Ground Temp should range between *88-93 F.

I've read about this I am definitely investing, make no mistake! I keep coming across different numbers... I've heard anywhere from 80-85 to 85-90F

 

[bud1988]

Make sure you file down the edges you cut so your Leo doesn't get hurt.

 

[LindsayMayer]

Make sure you fe down the edges you cut so your Leo doesn't get hurt.

I melted them slightly with a lighter to make it so they weren't sharp Also it would be great if you guys could take a look at the pictures I attached two posts ago. Do his legs look skinny, or is he just juvenile, or am I seeing things?

 

[bud1988]

I've read about this I am definitely investing, make no mistake! I keep coming across different numbers... I've heard anywhere from 80-85 to 85-90F

*88-93 F is correct for Leo's. One of our experts (Cricket4u) has confirmed it.

 

[LindsayMayer]

*88-93 F is correct for Leo's. One of our experts (Cricket4you) has confirmed it.

Alrighty, thanks for that, duly noted I do have a question about the lighting though, since I'm at school all day, should any daylight that comes into my room be enough for my gecko's day/night schedule if I'm using an under tank heater?

 

[thorrshamri]

Ok so...
Make sure there are no chemicals in the sponges you are using. Forest moss, once thoroughly rinsed off with clean water, put into the microwave oven to kill all bugs and their eggs inside it, then re-moistened with water is also a good alternative to fill in moist hides. I would NOT advise vermiculite or perlite in that particular case, because there are risks of impaction.

Your gecko definitely needs a bath. It will feel much better once the shed is gone. It is perfectly normal for a shedding animal not to feed at all. Plus, I am not sure because of the picture quality and of the actual shedding process, but your gecko looks a bit dehydrated too. Baths are the best alternative to help against dehydratation.

How do the feces/stools look like?

5" is indeed very small for a gecko of that age. You seem to do a really good job though.

I would advise, once the shedding problem is solved, to start feeding him with only 2 crickets given in the evening. Remove their hopping legs, and if they are not eaten the next morning, remove them from the enclosure and repeat the process until your gecko eats them both. Then progressively add more crickets. I would use Miner-All I (for Indoors) and dust the prey insects on EVERY feeding to help him recover from probable minerals deficiencies: Supplements

The red lighbulb cannot harm. Just make sure temps stay under 90-92°F at the hottest spot in the enclosure to avoid overheating your gecko

 

[thorrshamri]

Alrighty, thanks for that, duly noted I do have a question about the lighting though, since I'm at school all day, should any daylight that comes into my room be enough for my gecko's day/night schedule if I'm using an under tank heater?

NEVER let DIRECT natural light go through a reptile tank. It will overheat it very quickly. Now, if you keep the tank away from DIRECT daylight, putting it f.e. in a sheltered corner in your room, there will be no problems.

 

[bud1988]

feet and tail

I melted them slightly with a lighter to make it so they weren't sharp Also it would be great if you guys could take a look at the pictures I attached two posts ago. Do his legs look skinny, or is he just juvenile, or am I seeing things?

Lindsay, his legs look just fine.
His tail could be fatter but its not skinny or anything to worry about.

Just get him hooked on crickets, and give him like 4-7 mealworms a week.

Get the Large crickets and give him 5-7 a night (or whatever amount he will eat)

 

[thorrshamri]

give him like 4-7 mealworms a week.

:yikes: No way! Mealworms are one of the worst alternatives to feed geckos, especially "weak" ones like Lindsay's. I'm sorry to say, but avoid mealworms and superworms. Avoid waxmoth larvae as well. Stick to a cricket diet, and if you can find some, small locusts and silkworms as alternative prey items.

 

[LindsayMayer]

Actually, I did come across a couple of stools, and they were normal. Solid, brown with small white spot.

Also, he was fed almost solely on mealworms before I got him o.o That probably just added onto the problem. My friend gave me a bottle of Zoomed Reptivite with D3 to use with my feedings. I also placed a small dish of it in the enclosure just in case. Also I'm using crickets of about small/medium size, not too small but that's about as big as the space between his eyes is.

Thank you for the compliment I may not know much yet, but I have always been a lover of animals of all types and I want to be a wildlife biologist. I don't think there's any excuse for lack of knowledge and lack of proper care I don't mind asking questions, I know he will only improve as a result!

Should I give him a bath tonight or tomorrow morning when I wake up? I can now see how he could be dehydrated; whe I asked my friend which hide he used as the moist hide, he seemed to not know what i was talking about. He only misted his gecko during shedding times... which doesn't seem right to me.

Also I would gather some moss, but there is snow where I live right now For now I just used a thick layer of paper towel, as it seems there are no natural sponges at the moment. I'll pick some up next time we go to the store and just keep an eye on the moisture level.

Also, uh, how should I remove the crickets' hopping legs? I'm such a wimp. Hahah. Typical girl that doesn't like bugs.