Angry Geckos!

[smcnearn]

So after several years of watching my friend Alejandro's Tokays interact and hearing him talk about how interesting it is to breed and keep them and even seeing some of the morphs he keeps, I took the plunge.

They are in 29 Gallon Tubs turned so they are about 30x18x24 h/w/d. I put several pieces of 4inch diameter bamboo in each tub as well as paper towel as substrate so that I can observer if the animal is passing droppings easily. Heat tape running underneath is set to 97 and its about 94 on the bottom of the tub 88-89 near the top of the bamboo tubes.

I'm not offering them food until they have been settled for at least another 24-48 hours. However I am misting 3-4 times a day. I live in Colorado so their tubs have been drying out between misting.

After talking to Michael I decided to give a dose of liquid multivitamin and then take these guys to my local herp vet for a fecal float and dose Panacure/Flagyl.

I wanted to thank everyone on this forum for all the information and dialogue you have posted as reading it has greatly helped my understanding of this species, its acclimation and care in captivity.

Wish me the best of luck in my adventures with the mystique Tokay!

Oh BTW first post!

Oh First Egg!

Argh first bite!



Cheers, Sean McNearney.

 

[Aimless]

ouch!

 

[smcnearn]

Right?

Iv learned a lot from everyone's posts but none has mentioned how to get a determined Tokay to let go of a hunk of human flesh. :shock:

Oh I will be trying to get these guys started on Dubia roaches starting Sunday evening and judging from my thumb they wont have any idea what hit them. :evil:

Cheers, Sean

 

[Aimless]

I'm lucky enough that I have yet to be bitten by a Tokay...but a very determined snake can usually be removed by putting under a tap with cool water running.

worst-case (the water doesn't work) a very small amount of potable alcohol on the nose will make them let go...the keepers I know with aggressive species will keep a jigger of vodka in the herp room. the alcohol irritates the mucous membranes, so it's only an absolute last-ditch method.

does anyone know if this works with geckos, too?

 

[Marauderhex]

I would recommend against vodka or other drinking alcohol. I stick with ice cold water. Hasn't ever failed me yet. Aimee, you need to hurry up and get bitten already. The anticipation of the bite is far worse than the bite itself.

 

[Aimless]

ha, Justin, I got over that with my first python bite years ago. I got over it even more the first time I bred snakes; I got bit constantly for months.

thanks for the alcohol note. I wouldn't want to hurt the gecko, for sure.

 

[Marauderhex]

I've only ever had to use vodka on my Children's pythons, and that's because she bit and wrapped. Such a small snake, but an amazing amount of tenacity. I used a drop in her mouth and she let go instantly. I felt like such a jerk, and she wouldn't come near me for a few days. As far as geckos, I've never been latched onto long enough that cold water didn't work.

 

[smcnearn]

Iv never had a problem with a snake latching on and my worst bite was probably from one of my WC Morelia. But Tokay #6 coming out of the bag nailed my thumb and held on for about 20 minutes. They really have amazing jaw strength for their size!

I tried cold tap water but he wasn't letting go and I didn't want to overly stress him as hes fresh from Indonesia. So I just put my hand in his tub and waited, thankfully he detached and scurried into a piece of bamboo after a few minutes.

 

[billewicz]

OK, so I strongly suggest getting a pair of synthetic Tech/mechanic's gloves from Home Depot or Lowes for about $10. They are thin enough to have good feeling when handling your Tokay yet if they bite and latch, you can slip the glove off without harming it or having to wait them out.

:evil::evil::evil:Also, fresh imports are capable of breaking their lower jaws in half if they really get into it. This is almost impossible to fix or will take lots of vet money and recovery time. So slipping the glove off is usually much easier and let stressful to you both!

 

[smcnearn]

Oh I got some gloves before I sent you the vent shots! Ill check out the mechanic's gloves though as the simple cloth ones I have really don't provide enough feeling for me.

Hopefully aside from the vet visit tomorrow these guys wont need to be disturbed again for some time.

Wish me luck at the vet!

Cheers, Sean McNearney

 

[billewicz]

Oh I got some gloves before I sent you the vent shots! Ill check out the mechanic's gloves though as the simple cloth ones I have really don't provide enough feeling for me.

Hopefully aside from the vet visit tomorrow these guys wont need to be disturbed again for some time.

Wish me luck at the vet!

Cheers, Sean McNearney

Yeah, once I've medicated and supplemented them, I leave them alone, other than food and misting, until the next dose. Depending on the vet's instructions, that could be a week, or two later.

Enjoy!

 

[XoVictoryXo]

Thanks for the cold water tips! lol!!

 

[cassicat4]

I don't know if this works for Tokays? but a trick I heard was to gently tap the side of their mouth repeatedly which can cause them to gape and let go. I've used this successfully on a very determined skink when the cold water trick didn't work.

 

[billewicz]

I don't know if this works for Tokays? but a trick I heard was to gently tap the side of their mouth repeatedly which can cause them to gape and let go. I've used this successfully on a very determined skink when the cold water trick didn't work.

Ummm, no. They usually just bite down harder. And this is where they can break their jaws.

Most Tokay will bite and release the first time or two of being reached for. Most do not latch on until after a few nips does not send you packing. Once they roll their eyes back into their head and latch, they mean to hold on for 20 minutes at least. If you keep 'messing' with them at this point they just sink their teeth in harder.

This is where I slip the synthetic tech glove off and put the Tokay and glove back into it's enclosure.

I did have a couple hold onto that glove for several hours. :evil::evil::evil:

 

[MauricesExoticPets]

I'm glad you mentioned the jaw break potential, I think people tend to be more worried about being bit that for the gecko doing the biting.

I've managed to avoid any Gekko bites thus far, and I don't use gloves regularly though I likely should.

I'm not sure they are exactly angry, or more scared, I presume the latter.

Maurice Pudlo

 

[billewicz]

I'm glad you mentioned the jaw break potential, I think people tend to be more worried about being bit that for the gecko doing the biting.

I've managed to avoid any Gekko bites thus far, and I don't use gloves regularly though I likely should.

I'm not sure they are exactly angry, or more scared, I presume the latter.

Maurice Pudlo

Terrified!! It's flight or bite!!!

 

[MauricesExoticPets]

I'm more hands off and make every effort to eliminate stressing mine out, so I have yet to see any real bad freak outs from mine. My wife on the other hand seems to get the brunt of barks and gapes almost every time she is left to deal with them.

I think she is trying to move much faster and is less perceptive of what each Gekko is doing, but that's as much a guess as anything else.

I use gloves with a couple of our monitors, mainly because of the claws and not so much for being bit.

I know with monitors, once they get over that fear of you, you become a mobile basking spot more than anything else, well and that guy that brings food. Otherwise they could pretty much care less about you.

I suppose it's somewhat similar with Gekko, please correct me if I'm wrong.

Another thing I noticed with monitors is that the fear of humans they overcome can return pretty quickly. Would this be similar in Gekko?

I'm perfectly happy keeping mine as display only critters, heck I'm not sure there are enough hours in the day to try to acclimate them all to human interaction anyway, but I am curious.

Maurice Pudlo

 

[billewicz]

I'm more hands off and make every effort to eliminate stressing mine out, so I have yet to see any real bad freak outs from mine. My wife on the other hand seems to get the brunt of barks and gapes almost every time she is left to deal with them.

I think she is trying to move much faster and is less perceptive of what each Gekko is doing, but that's as much a guess as anything else.

I use gloves with a couple of our monitors, mainly because of the claws and not so much for being bit.

I know with monitors, once they get over that fear of you, you become a mobile basking spot more than anything else, well and that guy that brings food. Otherwise they could pretty much care less about you.

I suppose it's somewhat similar with Gekko, please correct me if I'm wrong.

Another thing I noticed with monitors is that the fear of humans they overcome can return pretty quickly. Would this be similar in Gekko?

I'm perfectly happy keeping mine as display only critters, heck I'm not sure there are enough hours in the day to try to acclimate them all to human interaction anyway, but I am curious.

Maurice Pudlo

So yes, I agree with the monitor observations, I'm just the guy who brings the food. And since I separate my Blue Niles for rodent feeding, the male is lickiddy-split onto my arm to be carted to his feeding den.



The Tokay are similar. The males seem less and less afraid over time and both sexes will come to the front of the enclosure to pick the first crickets/roaches right out of the container when you open the door. They grap a couple and step back into the enclosure.

All bets are off if you venture into the nesting area with your hand and there are eggs or hatchling present.

 

[Riverside Reptiles]

It can certainly vary a lot from one individual animal to another too. I have some that will literally come rushing out and jump in the cup of roaches when I open their enclosure. I have others that I sometimes don't see for weeks at a time. I'm very hands off with my guys. I let them choose the level of interactivity. If they want to come jump in the food cup, no problem. If they want to hide and never be seen, no problem with that either.

 

[smcnearn]

So..... all but 3 of the Tokay's have what the vet said was a heavy parasite load. It took my vet a couple days to do the research, but we just gave them the first Panacur 3 dose, he seemed to think only about half needed to be treated with Flagyl however after talking it over with a few people Iv decided to treat them all the same.

Iv been as hands off as possible, simply misting and the Vet visit. I really prefer to keep most of my animals as display animals and watch their natural behavior so even after the "settle in" period I still wont be handling them often. I love watching my crested climb down into the dubia dish though so cute!