Roaches out-competing Gargoyle?

[RhacAttack]

Hello all, I've had a situation arise that I'd like to get some input on. I have a sub-adult female gargoyle gecko in a large zoomed enclosure 18x18x24, with dirt, spaghum moss, live plants and led lighting, ambient temp in the mid 70's. I have been feedin the garg pangea crested gecko diet and small dubia roaches. Recently my gargoyle has been looking a little thinner. A couple weeks back I noticed that the gecko had not been eating as many of the roaches as I thought and a surplus had built up in the vivarium. I stopped buying roaches until some were eaten, or died off. I've noticed the roaches congregating at the feeding bowl (usually 5-8 roaches) and really cleaning up the CGD. I'm wondering if either the roaches are eating all the food before the gargoyle gets to it, or possibly deterring the gargoyle from trying to eat (gecko feels overwhelmed by the number of bugs around the feeding bowl.) I'm planning on taking the cage apart and culling some of the roaches tomorrow, but I am wondering if anyone else has either experienced or heard of something like that happening. There are also 2 Madagascar hissers in the tank as well, but they've been there quite a while and from everything I've seen, the gecko couldn't care less about them. Thanks in advance for any input!

 

[JessJohnson87]

I've been putting dubia in a sandwich container that they can't get out of. If the food is on the floor, they will eat it, plus a garg cage is like their ideal habitat. I would try to find some sort of container to put them in when you feed.

 

[RhacAttack]

Thanks, that's a great idea! I figured some roaches would become established in there, just not so many that they literally clean the geckos plate.

 

[JessJohnson87]

Yeah, only bad thing is they won't eat the poop lol. Dubia are one of the cleaner species of roach and the temps are not high enough for them to breed so they're probably hiding then come out to eat. You could probably give them some of the CGD as a nice treat and gut-load boost :biggrin:

 

[RhacAttack]

I was thinking I'd try to save the ones I pull out to start a colony with, depending on how many there are. I wish they ate poop! I'm actually breeding isopods to help keep a tarantula's cage clean, maybe I'll add some babies to the gecko tanks as well.

 

[Yoshi'smom]

My first thought was they won't let your garg eat.
I know a lot of people use live planted vivs for their Rhacs. I have no experience with these as I have the direct opposite of a green thumb.
I'd recommend the same as Jess did. Feed in an escape proof container or outside the enclosure in a feeding tank. This is what I do even though there's little risk of impaction with my paper towels. That and I admittedly hate bugs... so the less I have to deal with them, the better! lol
I have heard that the isopods like the rollie-pollies are a great addition to live planted vivs. They work wonders as a clean up crew.

 

[JessJohnson87]

I went outside to scavenge for some isopods but I think they've all gone underground. Another great addition for planted viv's would be night-crawlers aka earthworms. They will help keep the "soil" aerated and their poop is wonderful fertilizer! Plus they would break down any leaves that fall off of the plants and probably help break down the poop. You won't need very many in the tank that you have.

Kelly the isopods are rollie-pollies I think, at least they look the same.

 

[Yoshi'smom]

There are other isopods used in tanks for clean up crews that you can buy online. If you don't want to buy them you can go find some outside like Jess did.
I've gone out grabbed about 10 of them and put some in my hermit crab tank. They clean up big time.

 

[RhacAttack]

That was my thought too, the roaches are stressing her out, just like when there are too many crickets in a reptile's vivarium. I think the cup is an excellent idea, I'll be implementing it ASAP.

I have heard that the isopods like the rollie-pollies are a great addition to live planted vivs. They work wonders as a clean up crew.

They sure do, they're detritus eaters. The T I'm breeding them for isn't friendly and lives in a hole, so the less cleaning I have to do in her hole the better. It'd be great not to have to dismantle the planted tanks for cleaning either. Woodlice to the rescue!

 

[JessJohnson87]

I had a T that was not friendly either, it was a pain to take her out and clean her KK every month. I went outside and found 1 isopod but tons of worms. Going to do some gardening next week so I'll be on the look-out! I would say mealworms as another cleaner, but there is the off chance that the gecko might eat those.

 

[RhacAttack]

I collected my isopods last September, they're doing well, haven't lost any, but no babies yet. The earthworms are a good idea, I've been messing around with the gecko's substrate, next time I do so I may add some earthworms. I actually have at least a few meal worms in there that made it to beetles. It'll be interesting to see what all is actually living in there when I do the purge haha. Angry Ts are fun, huh Jess? Mines a cobalt blue female, and she's well aware of the fact haha. Another beneficial arthropod I ve seen used are springtails, function more or less the same way as isopods. Plus they're tiny so they'll most likely escape the gecko's attention.

 

[JessJohnson87]

I had the same one! They're so pretty and I picked her up at a show for $25, this was ages ago. I have thought about spingtails but I'm worried they'll crawl out of the screen on the front of my tub. The pet shop I get my roaches and hornworms at sells springtail cultures so I might go get some after Christmas.

 

[RhacAttack]

Let me know how that goes, as far as I know, none of my local shops carry springtails, but I'm thinking about ordering some at some point. I know what you mean, being worried about escapees. I can't imagine most traditional reptile enclosures would keep them in, but that may be a consequence I'd be willing to live with if they did a good job keeping the tank clean.

 

[JessJohnson87]

I have read about them coming out of the ventilation screen on the exo-terra cages. My substrate isn't any where close to the opening in the front of the tub so it should be fine. I will have to order some leaf litter, don't have any oak trees near me. I want them to keep the tank clean, less work for me to do, plus my crestie has pooped every where so far. Left me a stinky turd on his cork bark last night >.<

 

[RhacAttack]

Got to watch those geckos, they're crafty. Now if only there were arthropods that could clean the Tegu's cage...

 

[Yoshi'smom]

Rhac Attack, out of curiosity, how do you keep your tegu? For future reference.

 

[RhacAttack]

Currently I have her in a 40 gal reptile terrarium with deep cypress mulch that I keep damp, a few large logs piled on top of a large piece of cork bark. She basks on the logs and has a den under the cork bark. Also she has a large waterbowl and a piece of flagstone that I feed her on top of. The flagstone keeps the bark out of her food and files her nails a bit. Basking area is in the 90s and the rest of the tank is on the mid to low 80s, she mostly hangs out in the basking area. I also have a 5.0 UVB fluorescent running as well. I feed mostly raw ground turkey and raw chicken, with a variety of fruits and veggies mixed in. She loves papaya and bell peppers. Also on occasion I feed raw egg yolk (the whites can cause a vitamin deficiency) and very occasionally a dead rat or a couple hissers roaches. I want to start her on some fish as well. These guys grow FAST. I'm looking into building her a larger enclosure in the next couple months, luckily she's somewhat hibernating and that's slowed her growth a bit. For now I'll let her free run in my bathroom when I'm home. I also try to soak her in the tub a couple times a week. Still working on taming, mostly now I get just hissing and the occasional tail whip which is progress. She seems to enjoy having her back rubbed, she'll arch it to make better contact with your hand, but huffs at you the entire time. That is probably way more then you want to know, but she's my love haha.

 

[JessJohnson87]

I made a cage for my monitor out of 1x4's and 1x2's with plywood as the bottom, then used heavy duty construction wire for the sides and the top. Put hinges on the top and locks to keep him from getting out, but the whole thing opened up to make it easier to get him out and get his tub out when he pooped. I had a huge deep rubbermaid container as his bath/toilet. Then we built a platform with a ramp for him to bask on and cut a huge piece of pipe in half for a hide. He usually preferred to sleep out in the open though. Chose that route considering the fact that when he was pissed, he would whip his tail on the sides of the cage and nearly cracked a couple of aquariums because of it. Have you tried very lean raw steak as a treat?

 

[RhacAttack]

Thats sounds like a good cage set up. I want her big enclosure to be easy to take apart for moving purposes, one that opened up for cleaning would be great too. I haven't tried steak, I'll have to pick up a cut next time I'm at the grocery store. I took the entire gecko cage apart and started pulling roaches out. I think I have around 60 dubias :shock:. I'm sure I didn't get all of them, but I got the majority. All the roaches when placed in the cage where small/nymphs. Many of the ones I pulled out where sub-adults, found at least 2 mature females, and a mature male as well. Im guessing some of these guys have been in there for a loong time. On the bright side, it looks like I have makings of a dubia colony . Hopefully Terra, my garg will feel better without all of those "roommates".

 

[JessJohnson87]

Holy cow that's a lot of roaches! I say you have a pretty good start to a colony, in 6 months you'll have so many you won't know what to do with them. Kholtme has a self cleaning dubia set up, it's somewhere on this forum. I'll find it and edit my post with the link to the thread.


http://www.geckosunlimited.com/comm...tion/79355-self-cleaning-dubia-roach-set.html

Also about the wooden cage, pine and cedar are toxic, so I would try to find some other kind of wood to use for it.