Keeping crickets in reptile room

[Nocturnalnature]

Seeing as my collection consists of primarily herbivores animals I find myself facing the reality of several hundred crickets happily chirping in my reptile room since I acquired my modest collection of Knobbies.
Forgive my ignorance in the matter, but are there any speculations as to whether the noise is stressful to the animals in the room? I personally find it pleasant, but I'm not locked in there all night listening to it :biggrin:. I try to feed off as many males as possible each day, however it seems there are always newly molted males ready to take their place.
Once again, it doesn't bother me or my family members in the least, however I would like the input of others who have dealt with the same issue to see if there may be an issue of the noise creating undo stress on the animals housed in the same room.
I had considered Dubia briefly but their propensity to burrow in the substrate, combined with my irrational fear of roaches has put those plans on hold.

 

[NicKtheGreeK1997]

No, the sound doesn't bug the reptiles! I could say that they cover other, stressful sounds for them!

 

[Elizabeth Freer]

Seeing as my collection consists of primarily herbivores animals I find myself facing the reality of several hundred crickets happily chirping in my reptile room since I acquired my modest collection of Knobbies.
Forgive my ignorance in the matter, but are there any speculations as to whether the noise is stressful to the animals in the room? I personally find it pleasant, but I'm not locked in there all night listening to it :biggrin:. I try to feed off as many males as possible each day, however it seems there are always newly molted males ready to take their place.
Once again, it doesn't bother me or my family members in the least, however I would like the input of others who have dealt with the same issue to see if there may be an issue of the noise creating undo stress on the animals housed in the same room.
I had considered Dubia briefly but their propensity to burrow in the substrate, combined with my irrational fear of roaches has put those plans on hold.

Crickets are an excellent source of food for your geckos based upon an ideal ratio of protein to fat. Roaches have twice the protein of crickets, NOT a good thing, but good to add variety.

http://www.elliotsbutterworms.com/nutrition.htm

http://www.angelfire.com/tx/facehugger/insect.html


Here's a link to some 7 ounce glass storage containers which make great dubia feeding dishes because they have basically vertical sides:
http://www.anchorhocking.com/prod_209_kitchen_storage.html.

Get the ones with red or blue lids.

 

[acpart]

Are you buying crickets or breeding them? If you're buying them and go through them quickly enough, you can always get 1/2"-3/4" crickets and most of them will be too small to chirp. In my house, there are always crickets hiding out that escaped the cage. The place always sounds like a campground (we don't have a reptile room) and it's very soothing to the humans and I assume not an issue for the reptiles.

Aliza

 

[Nocturnalnature]

Thanks for the replies and informative links!
I am ordering in bulk since I am going through quite a few each evening. My first bulk order was a little over two weeks ago, and I bought pre winged, but as time has went by they are obviously maturing into adulthood.
I have to admit I enjoy the sound. I just didn't want to stress the animals with all the noise. Since the general consensus is that it doesn't phase them I may bump my order up by 500. The initial purchase isn't going to last as long as I thought it would.
As far as escapes, I bought a cricket bin from my supplier when I placed the first order and have been quite pleased. No escapes yet and no smell that I read so much about online.

 

[Elizabeth Freer]

Thanks for the replies and informative links!
I am ordering in bulk since I am going through quite a few each evening. My first bulk order was a little over two weeks ago, and I bought pre winged, but as time has went by they are obviously maturing into adulthood.
I have to admit I enjoy the sound. I just didn't want to stress the animals with all the noise. Since the general consensus is that it doesn't phase them I may bump my order up by 500. The initial purchase isn't going to last as long as I thought it would.
As far as escapes, I bought a cricket bin from my supplier when I placed the first order and have been quite pleased. No escapes yet and no smell that I read so much about online.

Check out the Leo Guidelines linked in my signature below. Scroll down most all the way to the end of the guidelines for info on how I keep crickets in uncovered 56 quart Sterilite bins which my friend picked up for me at $5 each .

You may be able to reduce your shipping costs by ordering a larger supply. By the methods I use, it is quite easy to keep say 2 wo and 3 wo crickets ALIVE for 2+ months past the delivery date. The younger crickets mature to ones the size of those you need. If kept in the 70s room temperature the crickets will do just fine and mature more slowly than when kept warmer.

 

[Nocturnalnature]

Check out the Leo Guidelines linked in my signature below. Scroll down most all the way to the end of the guidelines for info on how I keep crickets in uncovered 56 quart Sterilite bins which my friend picked up for me at $5 each .

You may be able to reduce your shipping costs by ordering a larger supply. By the methods I use, it is quite easy to keep say 2 wo and 3 wo crickets ALIVE for 2+ months past the delivery date. The younger crickets mature to ones the size of those you need. If kept in the 70s room temperature the crickets will do just fine and mature more slowly than when kept warmer.

Thanks again for the information!
You mentioned keeping them in the 70's slows down the growth rate, which is where I went wrong. I actually placed the bin next to my heating unit and noticed they ALL huddle on the end that is right beside it. I guess that explains why they matured so fast :biggrin:!
I'll definitely heed your advice and put the container on the far side of the room next go around.

 

[Elizabeth Freer]

You are definitely welcome. I feel every little tip helps.

 

[Riverside Reptiles]

Those supposed nutritional values that those links point to are lame. Firstly, only one of them mentions roaches. Secondly neither takes into account what the insects have been fed. Thirdly, the one that does manage to mention roaches only mentions dubia, not any of the other roaches that happen to make for popular feeders. And finally, both were posted by breeders of other insects that have an obvious vested interest in the out come of the numbers. These are not based in science at all as far as I can tell. B. lateralis make fantastic feeders for knob tailed geckos. They have a MUCH longer intestinal tract than crickets or worms which means that they can hold a lot more gut load for a much longer period of time. They also live a lot longer than crickets, so you can order a bunch and not have them die off so quickly. This makes for a much bigger return on your investment in feeders. And they don't chirp like crickets nor do they bury themselves like dubia. One other thing is that they don't tend to bite or chew on the geckos like crickets will when left in the enclosure. I've been working with lateralis for years now and have never had any sort of infestation despite living in a warm, humid climate. I have raised many knob tailed geckos on them as a main staple diet with great success over the years. Crickets will work well too, no doubt about it. I just wanted to clarify that the above information about roaches is not exactly what it seems or has been presented as.

 

[NicKtheGreeK1997]

Now I got to ask... Are leopard geckos one of few species that need food with low protein? Or is high protein a problem with all species of geckos? I could start my own thread, but the question is connected with this one.

 

[Riverside Reptiles]

Now I got to ask... Are leopard geckos one of few species that need food with low protein? Or is high protein a problem with all species of geckos? I could start my own thread, but the question is connected with this one.

There's a lot more to this than "low protein". Protein can come from a variety of sources including both animal and plant sources. There are some indications that too much animal protein may cause gout in geckos (this happens to people too). However, that blanket statement doesn't take into account what the feeder insects have been fed as a staple diet, nor does it take into account what the feeder has been gut loaded with, nor does it take into account species specific needs. It also doesn't take into account issues like purine levels and dehydration which are both great contributors to gout in humans. It's my belief that much of this is a result of people feeding dog and cat foods to their feeders. Also to consider is this is only a few incidents being reported. Not some huge sudden outbreak of gout in the hobby. But, as often happens, a few reactionaries take a couple of cases and blow it way out of proportion.

 

[Elizabeth Freer]

Those supposed nutritional values that those links point to are lame. Firstly, only one of them mentions roaches. Secondly neither takes into account what the insects have been fed. Thirdly, the one that does manage to mention roaches only mentions dubia, not any of the other roaches that happen to make for popular feeders. And finally, both were posted by breeders of other insects that have an obvious vested interest in the out come of the numbers. These are not based in science at all as far as I can tell. B. lateralis make fantastic feeders for knob tailed geckos. They have a MUCH longer intestinal tract than crickets or worms which means that they can hold a lot more gut load for a much longer period of time. They also live a lot longer than crickets, so you can order a bunch and not have them die off so quickly. This makes for a much bigger return on your investment in feeders. And they don't chirp like crickets nor do they bury themselves like dubia. One other thing is that they don't tend to bite or chew on the geckos like crickets will when left in the enclosure. I've been working with lateralis for years now and have never had any sort of infestation despite living in a warm, humid climate. I have raised many knob tailed geckos on them as a main staple diet with great success over the years. Crickets will work well too, no doubt about it. I just wanted to clarify that the above information about roaches is not exactly what it seems or has been presented as.

There's a lot more to this than "low protein". Protein can come from a variety of sources including both animal and plant sources. There are some indications that too much animal protein may cause gout in geckos (this happens to people too). However, that blanket statement doesn't take into account what the feeder insects have been fed as a staple diet, nor does it take into account what the feeder has been gut loaded with, nor does it take into account species specific needs. It also doesn't take into account issues like purine levels and dehydration which are both great contributors to gout in humans. It's my belief that much of this is a result of people feeding dog and cat foods to their feeders. Also to consider is this is only a few incidents being reported. Not some huge sudden outbreak of gout in the hobby. But, as often happens, a few reactionaries take a couple of cases and blow it way out of proportion.

RR ~

What will help GU members better than the links shared above are dependable analyses of common feeders from unbiased parties.

With all the above mentioned variables is a beneficial comparison even possible? Perhaps you know of such independent analyses? Please share.

Some folks are understandably squeeeeeeemish about those faster Blatta lateralis!

Here's another biased link: http://www.theroachguy.com/new_page_1.htm

 

[Nocturnalnature]

I'm squeamish of all roaches:lol:! Like I said, I thought about roaches for about 2 days and then decided against it. I am truly phobic of them which most people find amusing.
At any rate, if the crickets are nutritious enough (gut loaded of course) then I have no problems keeping the noisy little buggers.

RR ~

What will help GU members better than the links shared above are dependable analyses of common feeders from unbiased parties.

With all the above mentioned variables is a beneficial comparison even possible? Perhaps you know of such independent analyses? Please share.

Some folks are understandably squeeeeeeemish about those faster Blatta lateralis!

Here's another biased link: Nutritional Facts

 

[Elizabeth Freer]

Grubco states that these nutritional values have been obtained by an independent lab: Grubco :: Nutritional Information.

 

[SORROW89]

Grubco states that these nutritional values have been obtained by an independent lab: Grubco :: Nutritional Information.

Liz, I was thinking about trying different roaches but my friend told me a lot of them carry some protozoa parasite. I started searching on google and found this. Forget it now. They can carry serious stuff. http://whqlibdoc.who.int/bulletin/1977/supplements/supp1/bulletin_1977_55(supp1)_XVI-XXI.pdf

 

[NicKtheGreeK1997]

Well, crickets do as well. A home-raised roach colony will not carry those parasites, unless you stop cleaning your colony for some years. Most CB roach species of the hobby (like discoid, dubia or turkistan roaches) do not carry them unless you make it happen. But we are getting off topic here!

 

[Riverside Reptiles]

Liz, I was thinking about trying different roaches but my friend told me a lot of them carry some protozoa parasite. I started searching on google and found this. Forget it now. They can carry serious stuff. http://whqlibdoc.who.int/bulletin/1977/supplements/supp1/bulletin_1977_55(supp1)_XVI-XXI.pdf

This information is from the 1960's and 1970's!!!! It's not exactly recent science. Not to mention, I seriously doubt it is taking into account captive bred feeder insects. Also, you do realize that crickets can carry all sorts of evil things as well (not to mention the things that wc reptiles can carry).

 

[Riverside Reptiles]

Grubco states that these nutritional values have been obtained by an independent lab: Grubco :: Nutritional Information.

Unfortunately it doesn't contain information about any roach species, what lab provided this information, and under what sort of conditions the information was gathered (ie what the insects were fed, etc). You are what you eat. And the point of utilizing a nutritional analysis in this hobby is to determine what is most appropriate for use as a feeder. And then, you still need to take into account the particular species needs (as well as many other factors). Uroplatus might well need something completely different than Paroedura. You're not likely to find this information floating around google as nutritional science is just in it's infancy when it comes to keeping herps. You're certainly not going to find the answers on some bug breeders web site.

 

[panthergecko]

Ethan I wanted so bad the red runners, but I have heard they can produce smells and are harder to keep.
Plus they were out so I went with dubia (sigh)..
Do you have any tips for this species of roach?

 

[Elizabeth Freer]

Grubco states that these nutritional values have been obtained by an independent lab: Grubco :: Nutritional Information.

This information is from the 1960's and 1970's!!!! It's not exactly recent science. Not to mention, I seriously doubt it is taking into account captive bred feeder insects. Also, you do realize that crickets can carry all sorts of evil things as well (not to mention the things that wc reptiles can carry).

Unfortunately it doesn't contain information about any roach species, what lab provided this information, and under what sort of conditions the information was gathered (ie what the insects were fed, etc). You are what you eat. And the point of utilizing a nutritional analysis in this hobby is to determine what is most appropriate for use as a feeder. And then, you still need to take into account the particular species needs (as well as many other factors). Uroplatus might well need something completely different than Paroedura. You're not likely to find this information floating around google as nutritional science is just in it's infancy when it comes to keeping herps. You're certainly not going to find the answers on some bug breeders web site.

So, Ethan, what's a hobbyist to do? Where have you found the answer?

Abstract on roaches Blatta lateralis (Turkistans/red runners) and other feeders:
An investigation into the chemical composition of a... [Zoo Biol. 2011] - PubMed - NCBI

Study is printed on post #150:
http://www.geckosunlimited.com/comm...on/53949-feeder-roaches-care-breeding-15.html