Best Substrate for my Leopard Gecko?

[Rigga]

At the moment Im using reptile carpet, but when I feel her crickets she gets her mouth stuck on the carpet. I dont want to use paper towel or newspaper, and ive hear alot of negative things about sand.

Would something like this be okay? Or is there something better?
Zoo Med HydroBalls Expanded Clay Terrarium Substrate - Sand - Substrate & Bedding - PetSmart

Some people have been telling me about a coconut substate as well...would that be okay?

(I was looking for something that would hold moisture well too)

 

[sschind]

It won't help for moisture (that's why I use humid boxes) but I have been using this product on my juvenile to adult leos for about 8 years now and I think it is great. I'm sure someone will tell me how it is all wrong and I am killing my geckos with it but Like I said, 8 years and no problems.


Green Pet Incorporated

 

[Embrace Calamity]

You realise those are for use under something like coco fiber, right? It's not a substrate, it's a drainage layer. I can't imagine using just clay balls for an actual substrate. From that page:

"Use HydroBalls lightweight, expanded clay terrarium substrate as a base layer underneath Eco Earth (sold separately) or other substrates to create an underground water table in naturalistic terrariums."

Most people agree that tiles are the best substrate as it looks good, is easy to clean, and has no risk of impaction. I don't personally use it, but that would probably be your best bet.

~Maggot

 

[lisaowens]

i used tile for my leos it works really well it also gives good belly heat for the under tank heater

 

[Elizabeth Freer]

At the moment Im using reptile carpet, but when I feel her crickets she gets her mouth stuck on the carpet. I dont want to use paper towel or newspaper, and ive hear alot of negative things about sand.

Would something like this be okay? Or is there something better?
Zoo Med HydroBalls Expanded Clay Terrarium Substrate - Sand - Substrate & Bedding - PetSmart

Some people have been telling me about a coconut substate as well...would that be okay?

(I was looking for something that would hold moisture well too)

Porcelain, ceramic, or slate tiles are very good substrates.

For a leo tank you do not want a substrate that holds moisture. You need 40-50% humidity in the cage and higher in the moist hide.

Coconut fiber (Eco Earth) is not recommended. Substrates like Aspen Supreme pellets are not recommended because of the risk of impaction.

 

[Embrace Calamity]

For a leo tank you do not want a substrate that holds moisture. You need 40-50% humidity in the cage and higher in the moist hide.

Well, in all fairness, that depends on the where the person lives. Obviously if they're in a humid climate, that would be very bad. But if they live in a very, very dry climate, it might be a good idea.

~Maggot

 

[Elizabeth Freer]

For a leo tank you do not want a substrate that holds moisture. You need 40-50% humidity in the cage and higher in the moist hide.

Well, in all fairness, that depends on the where the person lives. Obviously if they're in a humid climate, that would be very bad. But if they live in a very, very dry climate, it might be a good idea.

~Maggot

Yes , perhaps? Clay culture balls, Hydroton, are quite lumpy ;-). Especially the "inside climate" counts. For instance, air conditioning or not.

Not sure how one would set this up. Free-range crickets and other feeders would escape.

Ideas?

 

[Embrace Calamity]

Yes , perhaps? Clay culture balls, Hydroton, are quite lumpy ;-). Especially the "inside climate" counts. For instance, air conditioning or not.

Not sure how one would set this up. Free-range crickets and other feeders would escape.

Ideas?

I'm not sure what you're asking. It was already established that these things are for a drainage layer underneath a substrate like coco fiber, not the actual substrate. So that's how you'd set it up.

~Maggot

 

[Elizabeth Freer]

I'm not sure what you're asking. It was already established that these things are for a drainage layer underneath a substrate like coco fiber, not the actual substrate. So that's how you'd set it up.

~Maggot

All the substrates I can think of to top off the weedlblocker cloth are ingestible.

 

[Embrace Calamity]

All the substrates I can think of to top off the weedlblocker cloth are ingestible.

Coco fiber and soil should be perfectly digestible as long as the gecko isn't eating it by the mouthful. I've personally always wondered how a leo would do in a planted viv like people sometimes keep pictus geckos in. I'm sure some people do keep their leos like that.

~Maggot

 

[Elizabeth Freer]

All the substrates I can think of to top off the weedlblocker cloth are ingestible.

Coco fiber and soil should be perfectly digestible as long as the gecko isn't eating it by the mouthful. I've personally always wondered how a leo would do in a planted viv like people sometimes keep pictus geckos in. I'm sure some people do keep their leos like that.

~Maggot

Thing is cocopeat and soil might be problematic, EC.

How can we "advise" a gecko not to take a "mouthful" as he/she dives for some prey?

Generally I like to speak from experience. Once a floral shop stowaway (a Hemidactylus garnotii adopted as a hatchling, but fully grown when this accident happened) ingested some Black Gold peat moss as she dived for a cricket. This peat moss is quite similar in consistency to cocopeat fiber. The result was instant death. I opened up her esophagus and sure enough there was the peat moss blockage :sad:.

 

[Embrace Calamity]

Thing is cocopeat and soil might be problematic, EC.

If you can find cases of properly supplemented, hydrated, heated, healthy adult leos becoming impacted on cocofiber or soil, I really would be genuinely interested to read about them. I've yet to find one.

How can we "advise" a gecko not to take a "mouthful" as he/she dives for some prey?

I said eating it by the mouthful.

Generally I like to speak from experience. Once a floral shop stowaway (a Hemidactylus garnotii adopted as a hatchling, but fully grown when this accident happened) ingested some Black Gold peat moss as she dived for a cricket. This peat moss is quite similar in consistency to cocopeat fiber. The result was instant death. I opened up her esophagus and sure enough there was the peat moss blockage :sad:.

Aren't those geckos half the size of leos? And how does suffocation from being stuck in the esophagus = impaction? Also, peat moss is quite different from coco fiber, unless there are several different kinds with different compositions. Peat moss is very dry and dusty, which coco fiber generally isn't, even when it has been dried out. I would never suggest keeping a reptile on peat moss. I've inhaled the dust from that stuff, and it's definitely not pleasant.

I'm pretty sure many people keep panther and knobtailed geckos on loose substrates just fine, as well as arboreal geckos like cresties, leachies, etc., all of whom would still likely be eating crickets off the floor. From what I've noticed, it seems leos are the only geckos that people freak out about being kept on loose substrates.

~Maggot

 

[Elizabeth Freer]

From what I've noticed, it seems leos are the only geckos that people freak out about being kept on loose substrates.

impaction = any blockage

Many, many people keep hatchlings and subadult geckos, not only leos, on paper towels from the geck-go :banana:. Other people use feeding dishes for the life of their geckos without harmful effects due to the lack of naturalistic hunting opportunities.

For leopard geckos, partly it is the fact that many leo owners are nOObs to the hobby. nOObs are more likely to be less aware of problems early on.

 

[Embrace Calamity]

impaction = any blockage

I have never heard anyone, in the context of reptiles (or anywhere, really), refer to suffocation as "impaction." And since your issue was with the substrates being "digestible," I'm not sure how this version of "impaction" is even relevant to the conversation.

Many, many people keep hatchlings and subadult geckos, not only leos, on paper towels from the geck-go :banana:. Other people use feeding dishes for the life of their geckos without harmful effects due to the lack of naturalistic hunting opportunities.

Yes, and many people don't do that. They keep other species of geckos on loose substrates either for part of or their entire lives with no issues. I don't know of any other gecko (or any reptile) that people so consistently say CAN'T be kept on loose substrates because it will become impacted. What is it about leos that's so special that they can't be on loose substrates while everything else can?

For leopard geckos, partly it is the fact that many leo owners are nOObs to the hobby. nOObs are more likely to be less aware of problems early on.

Becoming aware of it early on isn't relevant to impaction. If it happens, it happens. The gecko might be able to be saved if caught early, but the impaction will still have occurred. But, as I said, it will happen if the gecko isn't properly supplemented, hydrated, and heated, and that's where the noob problem comes in.

~Maggot

 

[Elizabeth Freer]

Becoming aware of it early on isn't relevant to impaction. If it happens, it happens. The gecko might be able to be saved if caught early, but the impaction will still have occurred. But, as I said, it will happen if the gecko isn't properly supplemented, hydrated, and heated, and that's where the noob problem comes in.

Those ^ are the exact problems I mean...precursors of impaction. If there is some issue with some of the above and if a leo is housed on some ingestible substrate, impaction can result. Some people think that the risk is not worth it.

 

[Riverside Reptiles]

You two argue elsewhere. You're WAY off topic from what the OP asked.
As for coco, coco/peat, or aspen, none of those are appropriate for leos. CAN they be used? Certainly. Are they an appropriate substrate for leopard geckos? No. None of them come even close to what these animals would encounter in nature.

As mentioned, the hydro balls are for use under a substrate to add drainage so the animal isn't sitting in water. So those are not a good option either.

Personally, I like natural slate tiles broken into large pieces set in a thin layer of sand. If you maintain proper husbandry and don't stick them in 4 inches of sand, the risk of impaction is very minimal. In all of my many years in this hobby, I have had no incidents of impaction. I have indeed seen impaction issues, but they have always been secondary to poor husbandry. Although these animals don't live in a pure desert environment like many people assume, they do indeed live in an environment that has a lot of sand, small rocks, and other particulate and they survive just fine despite it.

I also suggest reading through the substrate thread that is stickied to the top. It has a million and one opinions on substrates. Some good, some not so great. But in the end, you'll have a good view of pros and cons and you'll be able to make up your own mind.

 

[sschind]

Many, many people keep hatchlings and subadult geckos, not only leos, on paper towels from the geck-go :banana:. Other people use feeding dishes for the life of their geckos without harmful effects due to the lack of naturalistic hunting opportunities.

When I took a spring break herpetology class back in college we were looking for lizards all along the gulf coast of the US and this one lady kept saying "You have to go up by the old mill. There are get gos all over up there"