New to geckos....flying gecko or day gecko?

[ColdFire6778]

I've really wanted a flying gecko, but I've also been considering day geckos. They both are just so adorable, amazing, and unique in their own ways, but the important thing is which one is right for me. Here are some factors for which one I should get:
- I am thinking of getting an 18x18x24 tall exoterra terrarium for it
- I'm not planning on getting extra heating devices (besides a heat lamp or heat pad)
-not planning on getting any cooling devices
-I don't think either of these can live off those gecko diet things like crested geckos, but if one of them can that sounds good but if neither do that's fine-as long as crickets will do.
-I can't spend too much money on all different supplies they need-what I mean is, which one will I end spending more on in the long run?
-as mentioned above, I can't spend too much, but not only on the supplies, but also the animal itself. Is one usually considerably more money than the other?
-I can mist the cage frequently daily, so humidity isn't much of a problem for me, unless I need to buy all this extra crazy equipment as for if it requires a really high humidity (I don't think this is a problem for either the flying or day gecko though so this isn't really important to answer)
-I don't need to be able to hold them, especially since I know flying geckos have fragile skin flaps, but if day geckos can tolerate a little bit of handling that's cool and if anyone could tell me that would be appreciated



I think that's pretty much the main things, thank you in advance for any help as it is gladly appreciated!!! (Also thanks for being patient with me, I'm just trying to make sure I can set up the best home possible for the best gecko most fit for me:biggrin:

P.S. I know there are 2 types of flying geckos and a TON of day gecko types. If you recommended either flying gecko or day gecko for me, if you could list a few different types of flying/day gecko that seem to fit my list above the best it would be greatly appreciated thanks again! ;-)

P.P.S I know a few of you may have seen my other thread about flying geckos so you may be thinking, "I thought she was sure about getting a flying gecko! Where did this random question of day geckos come in!?" I'm sorry about how random that was-like I already said above, I'm just trying to make sure I make the best decision on a gecko that's best for me. . Just please bear with me here-like the title says I'm new to geckos and don't want to make a descision that could get the gecko or even me into a bad situation.

 

[ColdFire6778]

I'm guessing it's too close to call? I've had 101 views so far with no replies so I guess there isn't much of an answer people can give me-it's ok, I guess like I already said, they're both probably too similar fora really good answer on which ones best. Really I think I'll just get a flyer now and after really getting used to it and all I could get a day gecko also in the future.;-)

 

[Elizabeth Freer]

I think it's really difficult to recommend geckos for people. There are so many variables. Everybody "likes" some gecko for an individual reason. Day geckos are display only geckos; flyers could be handled infrequently. Flyers have pretty sharp teeth! :razz:

Thumbs up for a flyer! There is always time for more geckos! :biggrin:

 

[ColdFire6778]

Thanks for the info, Elizabeth! I see how it's hard to recommend geckos since no one besides you responded :lol: I like day geckos for the vibrant colors and how giant day geckos are really chubby :yahoo::coverlaugh: but flyers are just so unique and all so I think I'll start out with a flyer and get a day gecko in the future :biggrin:

 

[thorrshamri]

You said you can't buy heating devices?

Flying geckos, both species often offered on the pet trade (Ptychozoon kuhli and Ptychozoon lionotum) come from Malaysia and Java. They are 90% of the time wild-caught imports infested with red mites and internal parasites. If you don't have much money, that's a first reason to reconsider this option. You will need the help of a qualified vet to properly acclimate, rehydrate them and get rid of their parasites. That will cost you way more than the price you'll purchase one or 2 flying geckos.

Plus, they LOVE heat; they will only thrive with night temps above 22°C (about 75°F I think) and day temps should be in the cooler end of about 80°F/26°C with a basking spot up to 35-40°C, 12 hours a day, 365 days/year! Now you can reach such temps by isolating the enclosure walls with cork plates so as to avoid heat loss, and use a simple, standard 60 or 75 watts bulb from the next door supermarket to reach the proper temps (make checks at different times of the day with a thermometer placed in different places of the enclosure BEFORE introducing the animals to make sure the temps are ok). They also require heavy mistings 1-2 times daily, almost all year long except for the winter months (minus 2-4°F at that time and one misting/day or even every other day).

Day geckos ALL require an UVB source. Without that, they will decline, suffer from various health issues and finally die. Compact UVB bulbs are not the best option, you'd need a neon bulb with 5.0 or 7.0 UVB from the most performant brands, Hagen/ExoTerra being cr*p. If you buy a neon bulb+ ballast from the brands Zoomed, Arcadia, or JBL, these are better stuff than the Hagen ones but will cost you $ 50 or so only for the complete UVB basic set. Plus, all of them are super fast and prone to escapes. Flying geckos are very fast too and can jump several yards without problems, but if they happen to escape, they are a bit easier to catch than any lightning-fast day gecko.

May I ask why you love day geckos and flying geckos? Does it have something to do with their colors, overall appearence, size, behavior? I might have ideas for you with easier species which could match your own tastes, if you tell us more.

 

[ColdFire6778]

Actually I said I couldn't get anything besides lamps and heat pads but I don't think there even really is anything besides that for heating-I'm fine with getting lighting-and I can easily mist it several times daily-but I can get anything like automatic masters (ex. Monsoon mister thing) I've researched a lot and can easily purchase all the different basics. I saw your other post on my thread "flying gecko-please help!" I will look into the 2 geckos you listed-both look really interesting!! But also like you said, it really would be best to skip the flyer I've been looking into. :biggrin: thanks for all the info about lightning recommendations, heating, and misting, though! Much appreciated! :wink:8)

Oh and also, the reason I like day geckos is the beautiful vibrant colors, I think their eyes look really cute, and they're kinda chubby (especially giant day geckos) it makes them look really cute in my opinion :blushing: and flyers just look really cool-like something from a different planet or something they're really unique and beautiful-I don't really know-their just cool. But day geckos-it's just kinda hard to explain I just love them!!!! Their just really cute-if that makes any sense...

 

[ColdFire6778]

Giant day geckos are the main ones that are really...well...."chubby"

 

[thorrshamri]

Alright. I'll use my knowledge on US market prices so as to avoid expensive species as you probably won't be able to afford them. As I had promised, here are some alternatives to Flying geckos and day geckos.


Day geckos:

-Fan-footed geckos are REALLY an interesting group of animals (genus Ptyodactylus). They can look naturally a bit skinny, as long as they are not all bones and skin, it's ok. They are both active during the day and on evenings. Depending on species, they range between 5" and 8". Not as colorful as Phelsuma but a tad less fast, though they are swift climbers. They are from Northern Africa, the Near East and some parts of the inside of Africa (P. togoensis). They are rupicolous, meaning they will thrive in enclosures with stones to climb on, they barely use branches. They need UVB 10.0, 2 sprayings/week and a basking spot near 40°C, the rest of the enclosure being around 28°C during the day and 18-22°C at night. They will also benefit from a small water dish and are insectivorous only, they don't accept any fruit. They are particularly pleasant and entertaining to watch, the most commonly offered ones are Ptyodactylus guttatus, Ptyodactylus hasselquistii (usually both imported from Egypt) and P. ragazzi from Western Africa, the largest species of the genus, very colorful 8" geckos. Expect to pay from $20 to $ 40 for one, a bit more if they are captive-bred. They glue eggs to rocks. Eggs can be incubated inside the parents' terrarium once properly protected. All these species like dry and warm conditions with as much lighting as possible. Tip: to simulate rocky cliffs/walls inside an enclosure, buy from a pet shop silicon sealer used for aquariums, then glue flat stones straight on the glass inside the enclosure, on the background and sides. In DYI shops, you'll find inexpensive packs of stones used for inside decoration, they come in various sizes and colors. I enclose a pic of one my settings with such stones.




Click on the pic to enlarge it, animals featured on it are Ptyodactylus siphonorhina.

-Other species of day geckos: they must be kept moist and with UVB, just like most Phelsuma species, but most of them are tiny geckos, reaching 3"-4" with tail or even less. Geckos of the genera Gonatodes, Lygodactylus (the most common Lygos are inexpensive!), Sphaerodactylus all have great vivid colors. They will enjoy an arboreal, planted vivarium, they need space (1 cubic foot per animal at least, preferrably more), are very territorial just like Phelsuma. BUT they are also hardier than Phelsuma and, as far as my experience goes with Lygos, less demanding in terms of vitamins and supplements. They will thrive on an insect-only diet. The problem might be the babies, they are so tiny you have to feed them on wingless fruitflies or springtails. Here is a baby Lygodactylus kimhowelli I have hatched.

(click on the pic to enlarge).

-ALTERNATIVE SPECIES TO FLYING GECKOS:

I'm thinking of relatively fast, and cryptic species with some character, all of them being basically forest dwellers.

If you can afford a rather large arboreal enclosure (3-4' high at least, floor space of at least 20"x20"), species such as Gekko grossmani or Gekko smithi are a good choice. They are BIG cryptic geckos,reaching 10"-11" with tail. Their care is identical to tokay geckos, though they tend to be a tad less aggressive, but will attempt to bite when handled -anyway, flying geckos bite too when handled!

-Lepidodactylus lugubris, a parthenogenic species, really easy to care for and barely 4" long with tail, they can be kept at room temps. Though some males exist, they are almost all females and lay fertile eggs without any help/mating from males, babies are clones of their mothers. You'll find lots of info on them by doing a quick search on the forum.

-Some of the house geckos: Dixonius species from Thailand, Hemidactylus mabouia, Hemidactylus frenatus...the latter 2 species are completely inexpensive, easy to get as CBB, very adaptable to different types of climates as long as you don't keep them in totally desert-like enclosures. Likewise, you'll find tons of info on them by using the forum's search function.

-The large species of the Blaesodactylus genus ($ 150-200/pair). Really interesting, active and large geckos with the limited ability to change colors from very dark to very pale, very camouflaged too, all of them are crepuscular and nocturnal, very hardy; they are to be kept in large arboreal enclosures with stout branches and cork bark oak as hides, relatively high humidity (65-85%), and temps in the 78-84 range during the day, don't overheat them though. They don't like to be handled and will bite but make absolutely awesome display geckos. Several US breeders produce CBB ones. They are also completely insectivorous, though from time to time some individuals may accept fresh fruit mash.

For all these species(alternatives to Flying geckos), a regular bulb from the supermarket will both ensure heating and lighting. Hand misting bottles will do too.

See, you have tons of possibilities, and some researches to do :lol:

 

[ColdFire6778]

Whoa, thanks for all the info!!! Awesome! I didn't expect this big of a list and so much help, thank you so much! And like you said, I have tons of possibilities now and even more research to do!!! :biggrin: thanks again-all of your help has been really helpful and I really appreciate it!!!:blushing:

 

[ColdFire6778]

[/QUOTE] -The large species of the Blaesodactylus genus ($ 150-200/pair). Really interesting,[/QUOTE]


Wow! Just looked these guys up- I agree about them being interesting!!! Do you know the price for just a single one alone?

Still looking into all the different gecko species you listed, they look amazing!! Just looked up the Blaesodactylus though and wondered the price for just one (as I already said)anyway, thanks in advance!! :biggrin:

 

[ColdFire6778]

I think something happened to my quote above...

 

[thorrshamri]

I know the European prices, but the US prices can be fairly different. I suppose a lone male of one of the Blaesodactylus species will not be too expensive, especially as WC or LTC. CB ones will be healthier of course and more expensive. I wouldn't want to throw numbers out of just suppositions. I'd just tell you that a lone male Blaesodactylus sakalava or boivini can sometimes be found for the equivalent of $55-80 here, but, again, the US market is a totally different one for geckos with prices depending on your own offer and demand inside the States. Usually, you guys pay more than us for most geckos, but who knows. Browse the reptile classifieds websites

 

[ColdFire6778]

Ok, thanks for the info! Even if you don't know the exact price for US. I've been looking into all the different geckos you've suggested and just was curious of the price of those guys, so I'll look that up now-but if I do end up deciding I like blaesodactylus and thinking it's the most fit for me of the ones you suggested, I'll let you know :biggrin: ;-)

 

[thorrshamri]

I know several people in the US who work with this genus. I have them on my personal Facebook page. If you want me to put you in touch with these breeders, let me know through a private message here on the forum and I will tell you more. I always feel uncomfortable quoting real names on a forum, for privacy reasons, and some others might not like me advertising for such or such private breeder as they are competitors.

 

[thorrshamri]

I think something happened to my quote above...

You're not the only person to have had similar problems on the forum lately. I guess none of the moderators are responsible for this, it's most likely a bug. I am informing our admin in charge of technical issues right away.

 

[ColdFire6778]

I know several people in the US who work with this genus. I have them on my personal Facebook page. If you want me to put you in touch with these breeders, let me know through a private message here on the forum and I will tell you more. I always feel uncomfortable quoting real names on a forum, for privacy reasons, and some others might not like me advertising for such or such private breeder as they are competitors.

Ok! I'm still researching the different types you recommended (it's so hard to decide!) and if I decide on blaesodactylus I'll let you know! Thanks for the help! Oh also just remembered-do you know anything about rhacodactylus sarasinorium ? They look a lot like crested geckos (and the genus is the same in their name) so I'm guessing it's related? Just wondering because I thought they looked cool.

 

[thorrshamri]

Sarasinorum are a completely different story. They are much more expensive than Blaesodactylus and all of them, just like any New Caledonian gecko, come from a handful of original specimens imported years ago for scientific purposes. There are and there were no import at all for the hobby. Never. So all the ones sold on the market now are more or less related, which is not a good thing in my humble opinion. With Blaesodactylus you don't have such inbreeding problems. Saras are also quite larger than cresteds and not as easy to breed. They are a good 2" more than cresteds and heavier, with a "wilder" behavior usually. I used to produce some Saras but quitted all New Caledonians as I was completely gutted with the inbreeding issues and the craziness about prices and, in some of the species, morphs which are a selection of already inbred species. A too dangerous game for my own point of view.
Now as I said before, Blaesodactylus are all faster than any New caledonian and with a lot more character. They won't let you handle them easily and won't like it, and will likely bite if you try to grab them. They are perfect as display geckos, not as pets you want to handle on a regular basis. They are rock-hardy though, even as imports. Very active at night as well, and great predators. You will love to see them foraging for food. They require arboreal enclosures, rather large ones (I would recommend at least 75cm high/30", even for a single specimen), they like to rest on smooth branches such as large fruit tree branches, not so much on rough bark. Mist them every other day and day temps in the 78-84°F range should work with all species.

 

[ColdFire6778]

Ok, I expected them to be pricy-they look cool, but from what you said it wouldn't be a good idea, so I don't want to take chances. Thanks for the help! Blaesodactylus is still the one I'm looking into, it seems like a good one! Still trying to decide (I know, it takes me a bit of comparing and researching-I don't want to make a bad decision) it will most likely be a blaesodactylus that I decide on though, they definitely seem like a really got starter gecko. :biggrin:

 

[thorrshamri]

ColdFire6778, I have just sent you a private message. Check your inbox.