Getting ready for gecko

[Keith]

Hey all, I’m getting a Vivarium setup for a future family Leopard Gecko. I’ve done a lot of research, but wanted to start a thread to avoid any big mistakes. Thanks in advance for the help! I’ll add to this thread as it comes along.

Equipment so far. I’ll take a pic as I set up.
-Exo Terra Low Medium Enclosure (24lx18dx12h)
-11x17 Ultratherm 22w Under Tank Heater
-Combo dish for water and supplement powder
-8in dome reflector
-Exo Terra UVB 150 (26w compact fluorescent lamp)
-Thin foil backed duct insulation and foil tape for any applicable insulation.
-Ceramic tile for substrate
-terra cotta moist hide with water reservoir
-repashy gut load
-repashy calcium plus

 

[Elizabeth Freer]

Hey all, I’m getting a Vivarium setup for a future family Leopard Gecko. I’ve done a lot of research, but wanted to start a thread to avoid any big mistakes. Thanks in advance for the help! I’ll add to this thread as it comes along.

Equipment so far. I’ll take a pic as I set up.
-Exo Terra Low Medium Enclosure (24lx18dx12h)
-24w under tank heater (8x17)
-Combo dish for water and supplement powder
-8in dome reflector
-uvb 10.0 compact fluorescent lamp
-Thin foil backed duct insulation and foil tape for any applicable insulation.
-Ceramic tile for substrate
-terra cotta moist hide with water reservoir
-repashy gut load
-repashy calcium plus

Welcome to Geckos Unlimited!

Here are some comments regarding your post.

• Ultratherm makes an 11 x 17 inch heat mat. That's a perfect fit for a 24 x 18! Ultratherm UTHs are top quality!!!
• Probably your leo will not require any supplements inside the enclosure -- unless you get a hatchling.

Click: UVB for Leopard Geckos and many Geckos......Dr. Frances M. Baines -- January 2018

A Solarmeter 6.2 or 6.5 will tell you precisely what amount UVB is reaching your gecko. They are pricey!

Ratio of UVB : UVI (UltraViolet Index)

• Exo Terra compact fluorescent bulbs = 14
• ***Zoo Med Reptisun compact fluorescent bulbs = 31
• ***Zoo Med Reptisun fluorescent tubes (T 8 ) = 34
• ***Arcadia D3 23W E27 - no rating available
• Sunlight = ~40-50

Melody also shares:
"I have info on reflectors too, which can make quite a difference! Arcadia sells a good reflector, but you can make one yourself by bending cardboard in an arc and covering it with tinfoil. Surprisingly, the dull side of tinfoil reflects UVB better than the shiny side! And white paint reflects light but not UVB!"

There's an awesome FB group called "Reptile Lighting". Fran Baines is one of the admins.


Here's the Repashy's Calcium Plus (all-in-one) multivitamin schedule that GU's acpart (Aliza Arzt) has used for all her leopard geckos ----> breeders and non-breeders. You'll need 2 different powders.

Repashy's Calcium Plus (all-in-one) multivitamin
(without UVB)​

R = Repashy's Calcium Plus, Cc = pure precipitated calcium carbonate (without vitamin D3)

Week 1:
M-------T-------W------Th-------F-------Sat-------Sun
R.....................Cc...............................R...................


Week 2:
M-------T-------W------Th-------F-------Sat-------Sun
Cc...............................R..........................................

For hatchlings 0-2 months old: Aliza also places a bottle cap of pure precipitated calcium carbonate (without vitamin D3) in the cage 24/7.

Repeat this schedule every 2 weeks throughout your leos' lives.

 

[Keith]

Thanks so much for the welcome and detailed reply! I’m
Not sure if we’ll get a hatchling or otherwise yet. The plan is to get the Vivarium operating ideally before we even start gecko shopping. We don’t even have a clue where to get one other than the big stores at the moment. The only problem we have with that is not knowing the sex. We’re fairly set on the idea of a male.

I just got the lamp and it’s a 26w Exo Terra UVB 150. Hopefully that will work sufficiently with the bell reflector. It’s matte silver aluminum on the interior.

The enclosure hasn’t arrived yet, so I haven’t been able to start yet. I just have a pile of stuff at the moment.

 

[Elizabeth Freer]

Thanks so much for the welcome and detailed reply! I’m
Not sure if we’ll get a hatchling or otherwise yet. The plan is to get the Vivarium operating ideally before we even start gecko shopping. We don’t even have a clue where to get one other than the big stores at the moment. The only problem we have with that is not knowing the sex. We’re fairly set on the idea of a male.

I just got the lamp and it’s a 26w Exo Terra UVB 150. Hopefully that will work sufficiently with the bell reflector. It’s matte silver aluminum on the interior.

The enclosure hasn’t arrived yet, so I haven’t been able to start yet. I just have a pile of stuff at the moment.

You're quite welcome. Excellent on the UVB reflector!

Are there reptile shows nearby? That's an excellent place to meet leo breeders and have a hands-on leo experience.

Exo Terra bulbs are poor, including their UVB bulbs. When their output is measured by a Solarmeter, Exo Terra bulbs are NOT up to snuff. Maybe Zoo Med's Reptisun 5.0 UVB compact fluorescent bulb would be satisfactory. Your 24 x 18 x 12 inch enclosure does not allow much room for a leo to dodge the UVB rays when he feels like it. You don't want the enclosure very bright at all.

Sexing Leopard Geckos -- Leopard geckos become sexable at about 6 months old. Males can be distinguished from females by a distinct /\-shaped row of pores above the vent and by two hemipenal bulges below the vent. To see their vents, potential male pores, and hemipenal bulges gently press their bodies up against the glass. They'll squirm if you try to turn them over.

• Click here for a photo: Sexing Leopard Geckos

 

[Keith]

I’ll check to see when a reptile show is. I’m in the Dallas area, so just about every type of trade show is available here. I’ve studied up on the sexing, but the ones I’ve seen in the stores are too young and all look the same to me. The staff is equally clueless and say males and females are housed together. From what I’ve learned so far, it doesn’t appear they are cared for all that well either, so there may be some health concerns even if I was able to sex them. I like your reptile show idea. I’m sure my girls would have fun even if we didn’t leave with a new critter!

Too bad about the Exo Terra lamp. I selected it because it was only $10 and mistakenly thought they were all about the same. Do you (or anyone else reading) have an idea how long I should leave a UVB lamp on each day? I’m planning on plenty of shaded areas, so I hope that allows shelter from the lamp whenever needed. Also, is a day cycle simulation lamp advised? I have a Finnex planted + 24/7 on my 75 gal aquarium that is undoubtedly the best day simulating light fixture and that would be my choice if it’s also advisable for a gecko to keep its day cycle rhythm.

The more I read, the more confused I get. There’s so much contradictory information and difference of opinion on almost every aspect of Leopard Gecko husbandry! Plus, from what I understand, modern Leopard Geckos are domesticated. Therefore, simply copying the environment of their wild counterparts may not work either since they’ve adapted somewhat.

Thanks again for the helpful input! I’d be so lost without everything I’ve read on this forum so far.

 

[Elizabeth Freer]

I’ll check to see when a reptile show is. I’m in the Dallas area, so just about every type of trade show is available here. I’ve studied up on the sexing, but the ones I’ve seen in the stores are too young and all look the same to me. The staff is equally clueless and say males and females are housed together. From what I’ve learned so far, it doesn’t appear they are cared for all that well either, so there may be some health concerns even if I was able to sex them. I like your reptile show idea. I’m sure my girls would have fun even if we didn’t leave with a new critter!

Too bad about the Exo Terra lamp. I selected it because it was only $10 and mistakenly thought they were all about the same. Do you (or anyone else reading) have an idea how long I should leave a UVB lamp on each day? I’m planning on plenty of shaded areas, so I hope that allows shelter from the lamp whenever needed. Also, is a day cycle simulation lamp advised? I have a Finnex planted + 24/7 on my 75 gal aquarium that is undoubtedly the best day simulating light fixture and that would be my choice if it’s also advisable for a gecko to keep its day cycle rhythm.

The more I read, the more confused I get. There’s so much contradictory information and difference of opinion on almost every aspect of Leopard Gecko husbandry! Plus, from what I understand, modern Leopard Geckos are domesticated. Therefore, simply copying the environment of their wild counterparts may not work either since they’ve adapted somewhat.

Thanks again for the helpful input! I’d be so lost without everything I’ve read on this forum so far.

You're welcome. There is more than one way to successfully keep a leopard gecko.

Leos aren't really sexable until they are about 6 months old.

Some folks recommend a cryptosproridosis test by a vet, especially if you get a leo from a big box store. Vets can do this test by swabbing the vent.

I don't know what duration of UVB is recommended for a 24 inch long enclosure. Most UVB recs for leos depend upon at least 36 inch long setups. Leos are crepuscular. Leos are active at dusk, during the night, and at dawn. A heat pad hooked to a thermostat and a 15 watt photoperiod bulb dimmed to half power is really all you need, especially in Texas.

• Click: UVB lighting versus powdered D3 for leopard geckos?......Geckologist.tj
• Click: Establishing Proper Photoperiods for Leopard Geckos

Without adequate UVB or regular powdered supplementation leopard geckos are susceptible to metabolic bone disease. It's easy (and safe) to lightly dust bugs and worms in this manner. I use Zoo Med's supplements.

I know the following schedule works well. Many Geckos Unlimited leo keepers and I use it.

Weekly Schedule 124 for Leopard Geckos 0-12 months old​

Crickets or dubia >> Monday - lightly dusted with Zoo Med Repti Calcium with D3
Mealworms >> Tuesday
Crickets or dubia >> Wednesday - lightly dusted with pure precipitated calcium carbonate (Zoo Med's Repti Calcium or NOW human brand calcium) without D3
Crickets or dubia >> Thursday
Crickets or dubia >> Friday - lightly dusted with Zoo Med ReptiVite multivitamins without D3
Mealworms >> Saturday
No food or free choice >> Sunday

Future weeks:
Continue on since all weeks are identical. . . . . .

 

[Keith]

Great tip on the Ultratherm! I picked up a 22w ultratherm (11x17). I already had the 24w zoo med. Comparing the two, the zoo med reached its max temp much faster than the ultratherm. However, even though the ultratherm took longer to heat up, it reached a higher max temp. I was surprised since it’s 22w vs the zoo med’s 24w. I’m taking the zoo med back. I tested them by measuring surface temp with the pad sandwiched between 12x24 ceramic tiles. It wasn’t exactly scientific, but good enough to tell me which one performed best.

 

[Elizabeth Freer]

Great tip on the Ultratherm! I picked up a 22w ultratherm (11x17). I already had the 24w zoo med. Comparing the two, the zoo med reached its max temp much faster than the ultratherm. However, even though the ultratherm took longer to heat up, it reached a higher max temp. I was surprised since it’s 22w vs the zoo med’s 24w. I’m taking the zoo med back. I tested them by measuring surface temp with the pad sandwiched between 12x24 ceramic tiles. It wasn’t exactly scientific, but good enough to tell me which one performed best.

Thanks for the comparison data. The 11 x 17 is the perfect fit for your 24 x 18 Exo Terra.

If you're looking for a thermostat, I use and recommend Hydrofarm's Jump Start MTPRTC digital thermostat. Last I check Amazon it was $20.

 

[Elizabeth Freer]

Another thread's vet suggests an Arcadia 2.4 UVB 8 watt bulb for a 23 x 11 x 10 inch tank + powdered D3 @ 1 feeding per month as back up......LilBobbyD -- October 2017
Click & scroll to UVB lighting posts 1, 19, & 20: http://www.geckosunlimited.com/comm...g-and-heating/83943-uvb-d3-suppliments-2.html

 

[Keith]

Under tank heater installed...

Insulation/heat shield installed on bottom...

 

[Elizabeth Freer]

It's important to give an under tank heater adequate ventilation/"breathing space" for it to function properly. Exo Terras are already elevated above a stand. With your "insulation/heat shield" how is your UTH ventilated?

May I use your first photo as an example in my posts?

 

[Keith]

It's important to give an under tank heater adequate ventilation/"breathing space" for it to function properly. Exo Terras are already elevated above a stand. With your "insulation/heat shield" how is your UTH ventilated?

May I use your first photo as an example in my posts?

Sure. Feel free to use any of the photos for any reason. I haven’t had a chance to do any more work on it, but I’ll explain how the heat is removed and safe when I get around to the next step.

 

[Keith]

Elizabeth, et al, do you have any experience using under tank heaters on the back of the Vivarium? It doesn’t appear one heater will be sufficient to warm the hot side when it’s cold in the house. I was thinking of an ultratherm 11x11 on the back of the hot side. However, I afraid the heat will just escape without much makeing it’s way inside. The glass doesn’t have much thermal mass and there’s no tile there to soak up heat. I’m thinking a ceramic heater would be more efficient, but aesthetically, a hidden under tank heater will look better if it’s workable.

 

[Keith]

It's important to give an under tank heater adequate ventilation/"breathing space" for it to function properly. Exo Terras are already elevated above a stand. With your "insulation/heat shield" how is your UTH ventilated?

Here’s the Vivarium tile installed. I removed the silicone caulk from the bottom. This allows the ceramic tile to sit directly on the glass rather than floating above it on a bed of silicone border. The hot side and cold side are two separate tiles. Between them and around the perimeter is color matched sanded caulk. This seals the cracks, ensuring that all the heat warms the tiles rather than escaping. It also keeps the hot side from conducting to the cold side. I also had to cut .5in off the foam background to get it to fit with the new tile.

There is a 6mm layer of polystyrene insulation under the heat mat & Vivarium. The polystyrene is also foil backed for additional insulation. The insulation under the heat mat is critical to prevent heat from escaping into the air/room. Instead, the heat is directed into the glass and ceramic tile. I’m not sure how other heat mats are designed to work, but the ultratherm needs foam insulation under it to prevent inefficiency and heat loss.

After testing, the heat mat brought the 73f tile to 97f. After I get everything 100%, I plan to use a reptistat proportional thermostat. I’m so happy it’s coming along well!

 

[Keith]

Here’s some furnishings...
-This is a Terra cotta moist hide that has a water reservoir. My girls have already named the future gecko, so I painted it’s name and associated egg on the hide. Then, the outside was sealed with epoxy so only the inside would vaporize water. That should allow more time between refills.

-Combination bowl. I’m snot sure now what will go in it, but I thought I would need it.

-Multi level hide.



Where do I put the hides? Warm side, cold side or half and half? The multilevel hide looks good on the back wall against the background. However, the background texture prevents it from sitting flush. This allows gaps where light gets into the hide and the gecko may feel exposed. Is this a problem? Do I need it more closed? If not, is it okay to put it against open glass where the gecko is viewable? I thought that would stress the gecko and defeat the purpose of a hide.

Sorry for all the questions! I’m just wanting to do the right thing for the new family member and hoping you guys will alert me to potential mistakes before I make them!

 

[Keith]

Here’s the setup so far with the UVB luminaire installed hanging by a chain from the shelf above the Vivarium.

 

[GeckoFanboy]

Well, your pic is kinda little and it's hard to tell what's going on, but…

Regarding hides…

Warm hide - IMHO, should be just an enclosure with NO floor at all, especially if you are using a ceramic tile floor with a UTH. Why? Your gecko is going to want to lay in the warm hide directly on the ceramic tile, warming his belly to aid his digestion. It should also be the biggest hide since the heat needs to ventilate somewhat, and your gecko (normally) will spend most of his time here. This should be his coziest hide.

Moist hide - you need a moist hide in the center, keeping the cool and warm to the opposite far sides, making the most of the temp gradient. Keeping the moist hide in the center will keep it from being too warm or too cool. It will get the best of both worlds there, and give your gecko an in-between temp to relax. Cold moisture is NOT good for your gecko. You will have to check the moist hide daily though, if it's anywhere overlapping the heat mat (which is okay), to keep it from drying out. Your gecko NEEDS the moist hide to help him shed easier. I’d use your terra-cotta hide as the moist hide. You can keep the water on top of it, but I’d put a layer of crumbled wet paper towels underneath inside…and moisten it every day….changing it once a week.

Cool hide - I’d use your multi-level hide for this one. Put it against the side furthest from the heat mat. Your gecko will be just as concerned over privacy as he will having light beaming on him. I'd put that thing against one of the side walls, where you can kinda see it somewhat, but he feels secure enough not be exposed to everything coming up to the tank freaking him out.

Your light - honestly, this is the one mistake most gecko owners buy. You don’t really need it at all. Geckos HATE light. They are crepuscular and only come out in the wild at dawn and dusk because they HATE sunshine. It hurts their eyes. If you have a light in that room, or say you leave a window slightly open to let light in…your gecko just needs light for biological clock reasons. He needs to be aware of day and night. You could have a desk light set on a timer in his room, that comes on for 12 hours and goes off. Or you can do what I do…buy a really dim 25 watt bulb and a dimmer switch…hook it up to a timer, and keep it over his tank, not for heat purposes, but just so he gets his 12-14 hours of light each day (my gecko is in a room with no daylight coming into it). Geckos aren’t like snakes or bearded dragons where they have very regimented UV light requirements. They’re not basking reptiles at all (although some geckos do sit under red or moon bulbs). I have a double dome light…one socket is my 25 watt bulb, the other socket is a ceramic heater bulb (it’s not a light) - this one comes on at night, and it’s strictly there to make sure his cool side doesn’t get too cool. I have dimmer switches on both of these (you can buy them at Lowes). I keep this double dome setup over his cool side, and I have it setup so the temps on the cool side go no higher than 78°. Lastly, NEVER let direct sunlight hit his tank.

Water dish - get it as far away from the heat mat area as possible. Why? Because if your gecko gets sloppy in his water dish (and he will), if he splashes water out and it seeps under the tiles and hits hot glass it will crack the bottom of your tank. Plus, you don't want a water dish near the heat pad because it will dry out quicker (and who likes warm water...yuck). For your combination bowl, I'd put water in the bigger side and pure calcium powder (no D3) in the other. Don’t put bugs in these dishes. In fact, don’t EVER leave ANY bugs in his tank. Drop one in at a time. If he doesn’t eat it, remove it…he’s telling you he’s not hungry. Try again the next day. Or maybe he just doesn’t like the type of bug you’re feeding him (geckos can be very articular about their food). Try another type of bug. But don’t leave bugs in his tank, thinking he’ll eat it later…chances are he won’t and the bug running around him will stress him out…he’ll stay in his hide and won’t eat.

My gecko uses all three hides throughout the day. His warm side floor temp is at 88-92°, and the cool side floor is around 75-78°. Here's a pic of my small 10 gallon tank...(l to r): warm, moist, cool.

 

[Keith]

Sorry about the pic size. I just upload them
Off my iPhone, and it doesn’t give me any size options.

I just ordered a warm hide that adheres to your ideas. I’ll take a pic when it arrives. One fill up up question concerning the cool hide; would it be beneficial to apply black tape, or similar, to the glass where the hide is to colmpletely enclose it?

I read a lot about the UVB lamp and knew it was a contentious subject among leopard gecko keepers, but figured it wouldn’t do any harm as long as there was plenty of shade and it was only on for the proper period of time each day. It’s a fairly dim lamp. I’m hoping it will allow the gecko to supplement a portion of D3 on its own.

Now I’m aggrandize I may need a second heat mat on the cool side to make sure it doesn’t get too cold. That would suck since I already have the entire bottom sealed with insulation! Oops.

Thanks for your advice.

 

[Keith]

Here’s the gutload and vitamins.


Is it better to turn the gutload into gel cubes or should I just provide it in powder form?

With the UVB lamp supplementing D3, is it possible to just leave some repashy plus in the Vivarium and not dust feeders. Will he self regulate or is it critical to dust the feeders per the recommended schedule? These critters are so much more complex than my dogs! But I guess they’re on par with my fish.

 

[GeckoFanboy]

Superload is the gutload you use to feed your bugs 24-48 hours before you feed your gecko, but this is a gutload ONLY! This is not daily food for your bugs. Daily food for your bugs is...freshly chopped carrots and green beans or buy yourself some Repashy Bug Burger (which is daily food for your bugs - it's not a gutload). Basically, keep your bugs in their various containers, and the day before you feed a particular bug to your gecko, take a couple out (as many as you think your gecko might eat), place the bugs in a separate container with a pinch of Superload on the floor of it, and maybe a slice of gel Bug Burger, and let them gutload over the next 24-48 hours...then feed it to your gecko. I feed Superload in it's powder form, as I have noticed my bugs don't like this as a gel. But my dubia roaches and crickets love the Bug Burger as a gel...don't ask me why.

DO NOT place calcium with D3 in the tank. Use this to dust the bugs. I bought an 8 month old juvenile and dusted "every other bug" I fed him because he ate like a horse, and you don't want him to OD on calcium with D3 and vitamins. When they are young you can get away with this because they need all the food and nutrients they can get, as they are growing and this is an important stage for them to be healthy. Once he's an adult (1-2 years old), it is recommended that he should be fed at least 12 dusted bugs a week (which at that point might mean every bug he eats is dusted since adult geckos don't eat as much...maybe 12 bugs a week, LOL). There is a huge debate about how often to dust, but I am on my 2nd gecko now, and I dusted all of his bugs and he never OD'd...just makes sure you shake as much dust off the bugs you can before you feed your gecko. If you want, you can leave a small dish of Zoo Med Repti Calcium "without D3" on his tank floor. This WILL NOT hurt him. Very rarely do they lick these dishes, but it won't hurt.

It's really only complex in the beginning. Once you become familiar with his feeding habits and husbandry it's really very simple. Truly. You are just overwhelmed now with all the info at once. Use this forum as your resource to learn. They are actually really low maintenance pets...except for the bugs. They're more work than the gecko, LOL. I tend to clean my critter cages every 3-4 days. I say this because there is nothing worse than cleaning an extremely dirty/foul critter cage (the smell). Also, really dirty critter cages can become a breeding ground for bacteria and you don't want a sick gecko (from eating really dirty bugs). When you clean your critter cages (loads of fun, LOL) make sure you DO NOT use soap. Soap residue, although you can't detect it, will kill your bugs. Rinse everything with scalding hot water ONLY. Take everything out of the critter cage and pour the remaining bugs into a sealed baggy until your done cleaning the cage and it's parts.