Help Humidity and heating CHE+heat mat?

K

Klynn

New member
Hello I am a new owner to a Leo. The pet store sold me ALL the wrong things and I had to repurchase everything. I am obsessively researching and so much conflicting info. I need help!
Upgraded tank to 24x18x18 exo terra tank and decided to switch to UTH instead of red light for heat hooked to a thermostat. Works great but the temp in the tank overall is way too cold sits at 70 degrees in the day and gets a very cold draft at night. The humidity is 50%-60% and my leo quit eating for 2 days. I panicked and added the red bulb back and he was happy but humidity way too high. I bought a ceramic bulb today. Questions are:
1) Is a CHE bad to use with a heat pad also and will it solve my heat humidity issue?
2) If I can use this CHE what watt CHE to use and distance from top of tank?
3) Do I need to connect the CHE to a thermostat like the heat mat and is it safe to use a deep dome lamp or is a wire cage lamp better?

I am sitting for days on $400 worth of every product you can imagine and I am still confused.
Pet stores lie and suck!
My leo is ok today and ate once but I am worried for him.
 
Elizabeth Freer

Elizabeth Freer

Well-known member
Klynn said:
Hello I am a new owner to a Leo. The pet store sold me ALL the wrong things and I had to repurchase everything. I am obsessively researching and so much conflicting info. I need help!
Upgraded tank to 24x18x18 exo terra tank and decided to switch to UTH instead of red light for heat hooked to a thermostat. Works great but the temp in the tank overall is way too cold sits at 70 degrees in the day and gets a very cold draft at night. The humidity is 50%-60% and my leo quit eating for 2 days. I panicked and added the red bulb back and he was happy but humidity way too high. I bought a ceramic bulb today. Questions are:
1) Is a CHE bad to use with a heat pad also and will it solve my heat humidity issue?
2) If I can use this CHE what watt CHE to use and distance from top of tank?
3) Do I need to connect the CHE to a thermostat like the heat mat and is it safe to use a deep dome lamp or is a wire cage lamp better?

I am sitting for days on $400 worth of every product you can imagine and I am still confused.
Pet stores lie and suck!
My leo is ok today and ate once but I am worried for him.
Click to expand...

Welcome to Geckos Unlimited, Klynn! I hope we can get you on the right track.

Can you get an Exo Terra 24 x 18 x 12 enclosure instead? That will be much easier to heat! Products can often be returned for full refunds, if they don't meet your pet's needs.

For your current enclosure (& even for a 24 x 18 x 12 enclosure) I highly recommend an 11 x 17 inch Ultratherm heat mat. Those mats are tops and rarely fail. Sources include Reptile Basics, Wholesale Reptile Supply Company (Sacramento), Amazon (may be out), and the Bean Farm.

What is the general humidity of the room where your leo enclosure sits? Are you using an analog or digital hygrometer right now? Ideal ambient humidity = 40-60% RH, with higher values inside the warm moist hide. CHEs are ideal sources of additional heat as long as the output is controlled by a 2nd thermostat.

1) CHEs can be used in addition to heat mats when the temp is too low. Additional heat should decrease humidity. Leos can see all other colored bulbs. Even white light disrupts a leo at night. What are the dimensions of your current heat mat? If your heat mat is too small, I suggest fixing that first.

2) Place the CHE inside an 8.5 inch diameter dome fixture directly on the screen top. The bulb should NOT touch the screen top. This Fluker's 8.5 diameter dome may work with your CHE. Note minimum wattage numbers suggested by dome fixtures. It comes with an inline dimmer instead of a second thermostat. It is difficult to recommend a specific wattage. Maybe a 60 or 75 watt CHE?
flukerslampdimmable8.jpg​

3) If you need additional heat a CHE is the way to go. It's best to connect the overhead dome to a second thermostat. A deep dome or a wire dome just lets precious heat escape.


Temperatures - A temperature gradient from warm to cool maintains your leo's health. Here's a temperature guide for all leopard geckos as measured with the probe of a digital thermometer or a temp gun (and controlled by a thermostat set at 91*F/32.8*C):
  • Warm end ground temperature: 88-92 F (31.1-33.3 C) inside a leo's warm dry hide and his moist hide too!
  • Cool end ground temperature: 70ish-75 F (21.1-23.9 C) Usually the cool end ground temperature matches the room temperature where the enclosure sits.
  • no greater than 82ish F (27.8ish C) air temperature - 4 inches (10 cm) above ground on the warm end
  • no greater than 75 F (23.9 C) air temperature - 4 inches (10 cm) above ground on the cool end
Leave the heat mat/UTH on 24/7. If you wish, during the night turn off overhead lighting/heating (~12 hours on and ~12 hours off) unless ambient room temperatures drop lower than 67ish*F (19.4*C).
Click to expand...

If your leo has inadequate room light, add a 15 watt incandescent bulb dimmed to half power by a rheostat/dimmer inside a 5.5 inch diameter dome fixture to simulate a photoperiod.
 
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K

Klynn

New member
Thank you for replying. This is a struggle. I looked at the box and my tank is a low 24x18x12. Heat mat is too small zoo med recommended for 10-20 gallon tanks but does seem small to me. Just bought the cage lamp last night. Humidity in my house is always around %50 same as the tank. I was under the impression that the humidity had to be max 40% so now I feel better. I was using zoo med analog thermometer hydrometer but just put in a digital thermo last night. Waiting for amazon for The combo hydrometers and second thermostat for the lamp. Temps look good this morning. With the red lamp still because I was afraid to use the flunkers dome says do not use with heat emitters. Will return the cage and get the other.

Despite the pet store selling me a 10gallon complete setup meant for frying geckos he came out a lot and was active and ate like a horse. Now he hides barely can get him to eat 3 meal worms a day and never leaves his hot hide and pretty sure he is not drinking. I am eager to get this tank setup correct to see If he improves. Going on 4 days or since new inclosure being weird.
I have a 60 watt Che.
 
K

Klynn

New member
Thank you for replying. This is a struggle. I looked at the box and my tank is a low 24x18x12. Heat mat is too small zoo med recommended for 10-20 gallon tanks but does seem small to me. Just bought the cage lamp last night. Humidity in my house is always around %50 same as the tank. I was under the impression that the humidity had to be max 40% so now I feel better. I was using zoo med analog thermometer hydrometer but just put in a digital thermo last night. Waiting for amazon for The combo hydrometers and second thermostat for the lamp. Temps look good this morning. With the red lamp still because I was afraid to use the flunkers dome says do not use with heat emitters. Will return the cage and get the other.

Despite the pet store selling me a 10gallon complete setup meant for frying geckos he came out a lot and was active and ate like a horse. Now he hides barely can get him to eat 3 meal worms a day and never leaves his hot hide and pretty sure he is not drinking. I am eager to get this tank setup correct to see If he improves. Going on 4 days or since new inclosure being weird.
I have a 60 watt Che.
 
Elizabeth Freer

Elizabeth Freer

Well-known member
Klynn said:
Thank you for replying. This is a struggle. I looked at the box and my tank is a low 24x18x12. Heat mat is too small zoo med recommended for 10-20 gallon tanks but does seem small to me. Just bought the cage lamp last night. Humidity in my house is always around %50 same as the tank. I was under the impression that the humidity had to be max 40% so now I feel better. I was using zoo med analog thermometer hydrometer but just put in a digital thermo last night. Waiting for amazon for The combo hydrometers and second thermostat for the lamp. Temps look good this morning. With the red lamp still because I was afraid to use the flunkers dome says do not use with heat emitters. Will return the cage and get the other.

Despite the pet store selling me a 10gallon complete setup meant for frying geckos he came out a lot and was active and ate like a horse. Now he hides barely can get him to eat 3 meal worms a day and never leaves his hot hide and pretty sure he is not drinking. I am eager to get this tank setup correct to see If he improves. Going on 4 days or since new inclosure being weird.
I have a 60 watt Che.
Click to expand...
You're welcome. You mention: "Will return the cage and get the other." What do you mean? Your 24 x 18 x 12 inch Exo Terra is perfect! It's great he doesn't have a 10 gallon!!! :) Those starter kits suck! Leos don't like change.

When you sign in, be sure to check the box "Remember Me". That decreases double posting. Your second post could be deleted.

Good job! You're on your way.

  1. How soon can you upgrade the small heat pad for an 11 x 17 inch Ultratherm? That will NOT be overkill. Any area not directly in contact with the 10-20 gallon (4 x 5 inch or even the 6 x 8 inch heat mat) will be chilly -- similar to the cool end. That could be one reason he's chilling inside his warm dry hide. Everywhere else he travels is basically room temp.
  2. What does your Fluker's lamp say for wattage? A 60 watt CHE in a ceramic socket should be fine. Did you get the 8.5 inch dome? Mine says that dome works up to 150 watts. My Fluker's 8.5 inch box only says the dimmer function does not work for compact fluorescent bulbs. Anything but a CHE is stressful to a leo at night.
Analog hygrometers and thermometers often just give "ballpark" numbers. :(
 
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K

Klynn

New member
I just bought the heat mat recommended! Will be here Friday. Now to stick it on do I use foil tape and will I stick it under the tank itself like I did the zoomed or do I stick it inside the tank between the glass and my repticarpet? You solved all my problems. Best forum ever.
 
Elizabeth Freer

Elizabeth Freer

Well-known member
Klynn said:
I just bought the heat mat recommended! Will be here Friday. Now to stick it on do I use foil tape and will I stick it under the tank itself like I did the zoomed or do I stick it inside the tank between the glass and my repticarpet? You solved all my problems. Best forum ever.
Click to expand...
Thanks! :biggrin:

Congratulations, Klynn! You'll soon be receiving your Ultratherm. :) Stick it underneath the glass with the 17" side against your Exo Terra's 18 inch width. Snug this heat mat right up against one end. That should leave you with a 13 inch "cool" end. Get some Nashua electrical tape from a store like Home Depot or Ace Hardware. Make little tape rolls to secure the heat mat all over. Make an X across the whole mat; tape the heat mat's edges separately.

How are you set for supplements?

How old is your leo?


Do you see a Leo Care Sheet's Table of Contents link in my signature below? That will take you to many worthwhile articles on leo care.
 
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Marillion

Marillion

Member
As long as you place the DHP above a larger slate rock, it will help to heat up the enclosure area. That is what I use for overhead heating and on a thermostat to regulate day/night temps. I also use an undertank heater however.
 
Elizabeth Freer

Elizabeth Freer

Well-known member
Another option for overhead heat is Arcadia's Deep Heat Projector. Please check out other YouTube reviews too.

NEW: Arcadia Reptile's Deep Heat Projector! Powerful 80w E27 Infrared Reptile Lamp
Published: 7 June 2019


 
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K

Klynn

New member
I think I will be all set. I have Repashy calcium plus supplement now was using the D3 kind until I learned otherwise. I also have calcium bicarbonate to put in the enclosure but now see from the forum not to do that. He is still not eating well that I can see and used to eat like crazy before moving him. He actually left his hot hide today and ate 2 mealworms. Better then nothing I guess. Still feeding crickets but I don’t see him eat them. They hide behind the fake wall on the exo terra and disappear by morning which I assume he ate them or they went under the Carpet. I have a 5 year old son also and I am sure his presence stresses leppy out. The leo I am not sure how old but we got him 4 weeks ago at PetSmart he did not look like a baby. Young juvenile 4 inches. Looks healthy and he is sweet and tame, well was past tense he hates us now since we changed his house. Lol
 
Elizabeth Freer

Elizabeth Freer

Well-known member
Klynn said:
I think I will be all set. I have Repashy calcium plus supplement now was using the D3 kind until I learned otherwise. I also have calcium bicarbonate to put in the enclosure but now see from the forum not to do that. He is still not eating well that I can see and used to eat like crazy before moving him. He actually left his hot hide today and ate 2 mealworms. Better then nothing I guess. Still feeding crickets but I don’t see him eat them. They hide behind the fake wall on the exo terra and disappear by morning which I assume he ate them or they went under the Carpet. I have a 5 year old son also and I am sure his presence stresses leppy out. The leo I am not sure how old but we got him 4 weeks ago at PetSmart he did not look like a baby. Young juvenile 4 inches. Looks healthy and he is sweet and tame, well was past tense he hates us now since we changed his house. Lol
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Do you mean calcium carbonate powder? You may wish to remove that fake wall. Then your leo will have more space.

What is his name?

Repashy's Calcium Plus is an all-in-one multivitamin that contains cholecalciferol/vitamin D3. For very young leos up to 2 months old Aliza recommends keeping a bottle cap of plain calcium carbonate/no D3 inside the enclosure. Sometimes free access to plain calcium causes the gecko to overdue calcium. Too much calcium in the digestive tract CAN prevent absorption of other vitamins and nutrients. (I have more on this if you like.) See below what Aliza does when using Repashy's Calcium Plus for hatchlings. Zoo Med supplements provide significantly more calcium carbonate per dose than Repashy's Calcium Plus and other supplements do.

Let your leo adjust to all these changes. I think he'll come around. :) You may be interested in a feeding bowl like the sturdy clear glass tealight holders shown in the video I linked earlier. Walmart carries these. I cut off the back "jumper" legs of crickets at their "knees" to keep them in the bowl. The crickets can still move around.

Geckos Unlimited Aliza (acpart) has used Repashy's Calcium Plus for all her leos. She has bred leos long term. Here's how Aliza uses/used Repashy's Calcium Plus.

Repashy's Calcium Plus (all-in-one) multivitamins
(withOUT UVB)​
Early stage metabolic bone disease (MBD) problems include uneven (lopsided) gait, bowed limbs, belly dragging, and an underbite.
Click to expand...

1. Feeding & Supplementing HATCHLING leopard geckos - 0-2 months old & any slow-growing leopard geckos under ~6 grams ~ Feed 3x per week.
  • Feed Tuesdays, Thursdays, & Saturdays
  • Dust prey with Repashy's Calcium Plus (all-in-one) multivitamins at every other feeding
  • ALSO: Keep a bottle cap of plain calcium in the cage 24/7.
  • [See dusting chart below]
2. Feeding & Supplementing JUVENILE leopard geckos ~ Feed 3x per week.
  • Feed Tuesdays, Thursdays, & Saturdays
  • Dust prey with Repashy's Calcium Plus (all-in-one) multivitamins at every other feeding
  • [See dusting chart below]
3. Feeding & Supplementing ADULT leopard geckos ~ Feed 2x per week.
  • Mondays ~ feed (no dusting)
  • Thursdays ~ feed & dust prey with Repashy's Calcium Plus (all-in-one) multivitamins

\/ \/ \/


R = Repashy's Calcium Plus, Cc = pure precipitated calcium carbonate (withOUT vitamin D3)

Week 1 Repashy dusting (for JUVENILES & HATCHLINGS):
M-------T-------W------Th-------F-------Sat-------Sun
............R...........................................R...................


Week 2 Repashy dusting (for JUVENILES & HATCHLINGS):
M-------T-------W------Th-------F-------Sat-------Sun
..................................R..........................................​


-----> For hatchlings 0-2 months old & any slow-growing leopard geckos under ~6 grams: Aliza also places a bottle cap of pure precipitated calcium carbonate (withOUT vitamin D3) in the cage 24/7.
Click to expand...

For additional information click: Repashy's Calcium Plus (all-in-one) multivitamin Schedules for Leopard Geckos -- December 2019 update
 
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K

Klynn

New member
His name is leppy. His new ultrtherm heat mat came and it is working great in conjunction with the CHE. The ChE connected to a thermostat also it barely needs to turn on. Humidity and air temp is on point now! He did however immediately run and hide on the cool side for a day. Totally hates change and takes days to get him comfortable again after moving anything. Today I am going to get tile cut for his enclosure because he grabs the carpet instead of the crickets and they get away.
 
C

Curt Hatt

New member
8A8F3B85-3DB7-4558-80D9-29EBE01229FA.jpg

I bought the 80w Arcadia DHP. Was only $1.00 more and when it’s on a dimmer I only have to set it a bit over halfway to heat my slat to between 90-92. Gives you room To to grow getting the 80w.
I use a black heat bulb to heat the air in my enclosure. I also have the exo terra 24x18x12. I love it.
I just removed the background and replaced it with a ceramic Jungle Bobs. Flat one. Gives you more space and matches my Jungle Bob cave and ledge pieces.
 
Elizabeth Freer

Elizabeth Freer

Well-known member
Curt Hatt said:
View attachment 48401

I bought the 80w Arcadia DHP. Was only $1.00 more and when it’s on a dimmer I only have to set it a bit over halfway to heat my slat to between 90-92. Gives you room To to grow getting the 80w.
I use a black heat bulb to heat the air in my enclosure. I also have the exo terra 24x18x12. I love it.
I just removed the background and replaced it with a ceramic Jungle Bobs. Flat one. Gives you more space and matches my Jungle Bob cave and ledge pieces.
Click to expand...

I wonder whether your DHP by itself is enough to sufficiently warm the air?
 
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